Retorque wheel and FEL bolts

[RalphVa]

Everyone doing this every 50 hours?

I've never ever done it on 3 tractors. Have never had a loose bolt. Who has had a loose bolt?

I went out today and marked the ones they say to retorque. Lots of 108s. 60s on front wheels and about 4 or so 66s on FEL mount.

Not sure I'm gonna do it. Some of the ones on the FEL mount are rather hard to get to.

108 is a bit much on an ~18 inch click wrench for this old guy.

 

[SDT]

Everyone doing this every 50 hours?

I've never ever done it on 3 tractors. Have never had a loose bolt. Who has had a loose bolt?

I went out today and marked the ones they say to retorque. Lots of 108s. 60s on front wheels and about 4 or so 66s on FEL mount.

Not sure I'm gonna do it. Some of the ones on the FEL mount are rather hard to get to.

108 is a bit much on an ~18 inch click wrench for this old guy.

Neighbor bought a low hour Mahindra. Out of warranty shortly after purchase.

Rear wheel lug bolts loosened requiring replacement of wheel center, all wheel studs, and 30+ mile service call. Not uncommon.

FWIW: Owner dumped Rim Guard to enable loading tire/wheel into PU truck.

Eventually needed to replace tube and Rim Guard.

Yet another reason why I never use liquid ballast.

SDT

 

[DeepWoods]

I do torque my wheel nuts and bolts every 50 hours, but I have almost 500 hours on my tractor and have yet to checked any of the bolts for the FEL, Backhoe, or frame. Really can’t give a reason why I haven’t checked the others, other than when I mounted the subframe for my front mount snowblower, I was suppose to torque them to some insane number that I’m just not strong enough anymore to get them as tight as they required. Gave it all I could, and moved on.

 

[Henro]

Good reminder. 20 years now and I can't remember checking my rear wheel bolts/nuts...on my B2910. Smaller tractor I did, since I added rear wheel spacers a couple years ago.

 

[BCfromVA]

Everyone doing this every 50 hours?

I've never ever done it on 3 tractors. Have never had a loose bolt. Who has had a loose bolt?

I went out today and marked the ones they say to retorque. Lots of 108s. 60s on front wheels and about 4 or so 66s on FEL mount.

Not sure I'm gonna do it. Some of the ones on the FEL mount are rather hard to get to.

108 is a bit much on an ~18 inch click wrench for this old guy.

I never really liked the term "retorque". I worked in industry for years and spent a lot of time dealing with torque issues. We typically don't retorque anything. What generally happens is we set a torque wrench, usually a clicker, at some value, apply it to the bolt or nut, and if it clicks we say we are good. At that point, however, all you know is the breakaway torque for that fastener is higher than the torque selected on the wrench, unless the fastener actually moved. You are only torqueing the bolt if it is moving. Torque control and all the variables associated with it, is one of the most misunderstood topics. Anyway, I rarely ever check a fastener for tightness unless I have a reason to suspect it could be loose. Never had much of a problem with loose fasteners.

 

[nbking]

Once I did my first torque, soon after i got my tractor. I used torque stripe on it. Easy to see, and check whenever i want.

 

[lynnmor]

I checked all my lugnuts, loader bolts, sub-frame bolts and backhoe bolts at approximately 10 hours. Every da## one of them was anywhere from somewhat loose or loose as he!!. All of this was from an incompetent dealer. You better check, it is almost impossible to hire good help today. Yes, I had numerous other issues as well, some dealer related, some Kubota goofs.

 

[NCL4701]

I checked mine at 50 hours and the majority moved. Again at 100 hours and 150 hours some moved. 200 hours was first interval nothing moved. Still check, but no movement past 200 hours.

 

[mcfarmall]

I checked the tightness of all the wheel bolts and loader bracket bolts at 5 hours, 10 hours, 50 hours and 100 hours. After the 10 hour check, they were fine. I'm at 146 hours today.

 

[RalphVa]

I never really liked the term "retorque". I worked in industry for years and spent a lot of time dealing with torque issues. We typically don't retorque anything. What generally happens is we set a torque wrench, usually a clicker, at some value, apply it to the bolt or nut, and if it clicks we say we are good. At that point, however, all you know is the breakaway torque for that fastener is higher than the torque selected on the wrench, unless the fastener actually moved. You are only torqueing the bolt if it is moving. Torque control and all the variables associated with it, is one of the most misunderstood topics. Anyway, I rarely ever check a fastener for tightness unless I have a reason to suspect it could be loose. Never had much of a problem with loose fasteners.

Yeah. If I do it, I'll not loosen and retorque. Just set torque and let it click. If it moves any before the click, I'll know they were loose.

 

[Flintknapper]

I never really liked the term "retorque". I worked in industry for years and spent a lot of time dealing with torque issues. We typically don't retorque anything. What generally happens is we set a torque wrench, usually a clicker, at some value, apply it to the bolt or nut, and if it clicks we say we are good. At that point, however, all you know is the breakaway torque for that fastener is higher than the torque selected on the wrench, unless the fastener actually moved. You are only torqueing the bolt if it is moving. Torque control and all the variables associated with it, is one of the most misunderstood topics. Anyway, I rarely ever check a fastener for tightness unless I have a reason to suspect it could be loose. Never had much of a problem with loose fasteners.

^^^^^

This is correct.

It is a fine point.....but there are indeed distinct differences between Static and Dynamic Torque. Let alone Break-Away torque which is an entirely different matter.

I suspect manufacturers have simply chosen their words poorly. The intent surely is to check for 'loose fasteners' and not to actually apply 'accurate' torque figures.

I have my doubts that the average equipment owner/user even has the torque figures at hand. To which I would suggest falling back on the German Industry Standard of 'Gutten Tight'.

 

[Pawnee]

Just my opinion:
Most bolts don't need to be re-torqued.
Wheel bolts do need to be because the wheel might not be perfectly seated in position when they are torqued the first time. It's a heavy assembly which counts on bolt torque to position - not just to hold in place.
On the car when switching Summer and Winter wheels I torque them, drive down the lane and back, torque them again, and after 100Km do it a final time.
Usually, out of 20 wheel nuts, 2 or 3 move a smidge on the third go round.

On my tractor at 5 hours, 3 of them moved a smidge.
I doubt it would have ever been a problem - it's just the difference between 'good practice' and 'hoping for no trouble'.

 

[mcfarmall]

Lug centric wheels (most trailers) are more likely to be out of position when installed. Hub centric wheels (most cars) are much less likely to be misaligned when installed. For lug centric wheels, I put one lug nut down so that taper is seated in the hole, then pivot the wheel on that stud to align the next one and so on.

 

[GeoHorn]

I never really liked the term "retorque". I worked in industry for years and spent a lot of time dealing with torque issues. We typically don't retorque anything. What generally happens is we set a torque wrench, usually a clicker, at some value, apply it to the bolt or nut, and if it clicks we say we are good. At that point, however, all you know is the breakaway torque for that fastener is higher than the torque selected on the wrench, unless the fastener actually moved. You are only torqueing the bolt if it is moving. Torque control and all the variables associated with it, is one of the most misunderstood topics. Anyway, I rarely ever check a fastener for tightness unless I have a reason to suspect it could be loose. Never had much of a problem with loose fasteners.

You are correct as to what a re-torque requres…movement of the fastener…but you are INcorrect as to purpose of torque “check”.….(sometimes incorrectly referred-to as a “re-torque”.

A RE-Torque exercise is to determine if the fastener has lost its’ original torque and loosened. As you pointed out…if the break-away torque is greater than the original specified torque…then no movement of the fastener will occur. That is good.

But a re-torque attempt that actually DOES MOVE the fastener…will detect an improperly torqued or a loose fastener ….and should re-set it correctly….. And FUTURE attempts will reveal a fastener which is defective and may need complete replacement and/or a locking device (washer, tab-washer, Lok-Tite, etc.)

Conclusion: There is no harm in a “re-torque” attempt but there is good reason to occasionally attempt it.

 

[mikester]

I mark all my wheel and loader bolts at the 12 o'clock position with a paint pen to make it easier to spot if something is out of whack. I can do a visual walk around at start up and I check the torque every 200 hours now on my major service interval.

 

[woodman55]

Personally I would rather check 100 wheels than damage one. To me it is cheap insurance. I am going to open another thread on the use of lube on wheel studs/bolts. Should make for a interesting conversation.

 

[GeoHorn]

My Ram pickup has had a wheel balance problem since I bought it in 2013….the wheels having been off at least 50 times for re-balancing or rotation, etc. When I asked what the life-expectancy is of lug nuts and the wheel studs…. no one seems to have an answer. Yet anytime the nuts are R&R’d there’s clear evidence of fine metal filings present…indicating that wear DOES occur.

I’m guessing that the torque-specification in also intended to “proof” the lugnuts/studs….that if the recommended torque can be met without stripping the nut/stud…. then sufficient thread -engagement must be satisfactory.

Any thoughts on this by others?

 

[jimh406]

My lug nuts on my L2501 were off the torque spec the first time I checked them.

As far as truck lug nuts goes. I've never had it happened if the nuts were torqued. Sometimes, the tire guys skip that step. Not very often, but sometimes.

 

[mikester]

My Ram pickup has had a wheel balance problem since I bought it in 2013….the wheels having been off at least 50 times for re-balancing or rotation, etc. When I asked what the life-expectancy is of lug nuts and the wheel studs…. no one seems to have an answer. Yet anytime the nuts are R&R’d there’s clear evidence of fine metal filings present…indicating that wear DOES occur.

I’m guessing that the torque-specification in also intended to “proof” the lugnuts/studs….that if the recommended torque can be met without stripping the nut/stud…. then sufficient thread -engagement must be satisfactory.

Any thoughts on this by others?

My experience with many tire shops is the high school flunky can do more damage than fix, many opting to use an impact gun often with the wrong sized socket to drive on nuts one at a time an FU your studs, nuts, wheels, balance,...

The life of your lug nut will depend on the operator installing them. I've had 30+ year old vehicles with original nuts and studs. I recently had to buy two new plated acorn nuts for the inlaws late model SUV because the numnut doing their last service used the wrong socket and split the casing as well as deformed the nuts.

FYI these flunkies also work at the quicky lube shops and will also FU your oil drain plugs and filters.

 

[GeoHorn]

FYI these flunkies also work at the quicky lube shops and will also FU your oil drain plugs and filters.

I’ve had to replace TWO oil sumps (pans) in two different vehicles because the WalMart “service department” cross-threaded/stripped and tried to re-seal with Blue Lok-Tite the drain plugs.

However, these were not high-school flunkies…at least not recent ones…. they were older guys who should have known better and who should have immediately notified the customer… (me) …instead of forcing the damaged plug back into-position and glueing it shut… leaving me to discover it late at night during an oil-change at home to facilitate an early-A.M. departure on vacation.

Two DIFFERENT vehicles.

I don’t mind changing my own oil…. I just hate having so many jugs of used oil laying about the place until I can find the time to drive 30 miles round-trip to drop the old oil off back where I bought it ….(usually also at the nearest small-town WalMart. If there were an optional recycling place I’d certainly choose it.)

Also, the local WalMart “service center” nazi goes nuts if more than the shop policy of 2-1/2 gallons of used oil is brought for disposal. He also is not helpful and insists that the nicely-dressed CUSTOMER pour the old oil into the recycle-tank…. instead of offering any help.

Since I usually only make a “used oil disposal run” once a year.…. and despite the fact ALL the old oil left that same store as New Oil over the last 12 months…It was ALL purchased RIGHT THERE…
But The blue-shirted storm-trooper always raises hell if more than 2.5 gals of oil is brought for disposal…. so I leave them a “gift” of about a dozen jugs of used oil once a year…..Late at night when the shop is closed and Goebbels has gone home… I ease my pickup back to the closed shop…let the tailgate down…and off-load at least a dozen jugs for THEM to pour into the tank…..(But I do not do this anonymously… I always make certain he knows it is me…. I always wave a friendly finger at the security-camera overhead outside the locked service doors.)