??? on loading Tires

[lreops]

I have a question about loading up tires. Is it the general rule that when you load up your tires that you use a tube for the load? Or is it acceptable to just load up a tubeless tire? I sort of figure that the general consensus would be to use a tube for the protection of the rim from corrosion, but, when I checked the price of the tubes, I was somewhat floored when I saw the price of them. In my case, a 13.6X16 tube was around $240.00. I only checked that one place because I was so surprised I stopped looking for other prices.

So, for those of us that aren't really eager to part with our hard earned retirement funds, Can one get by with loading tires without a tube and expect a few, if not more, good years of service without any major concerns?

I was planning on using RimGuard, WWF, or an anti-freeze in water solution. Don't want no parts with calcium chloride.

Interested in hearing some thoughts on this subject and apologize if this has been brought up in the past.

Ron

 

[Lil Foot]

a 13.6X16 tube was around $240.00

Are you kidding me?!
Granted it's a smaller size, but I just bought a 6" x 12" tube including installation for $13......

 

[Stumpy]

As far as I know most people run liquid ballast tubeless and I agree that price is 7 kinds of ridiculous for a tube install. You could almost buy a new tire installed for that price. I found the tube itself for $50 online. As long as your ballast is relatively inert to steel and rubber you should have no problems. Rimguard will be your sure bet there but other cheaper options will probably work.

 

[Bluegill]

Yeah, that price for tubes ain't right!

Mine are tubeless and filled.

 

[Eric McCarthy]

I hear the price for rubbers has gone up but thats effen rediclious! I'm tubeless in my tires and havent has an issue yet. And as Stumpy stated as long as it wont cause rust or corrision you should be fine.

 

[hodge]

Actually, I have never heard of loading tires with tubes. Maybe it can be done, but I haven't come across it.
Either way, you can load tubeless tires. Lots of us have proven that.

 

[284 International]

I run inner tubes in my filled tires, but many do not. My theory is that keeping the moisture away from even the painted rim can only prolong the life of my rims. One nice thing is that the tractor tubes have a larger diameter valve lumen available for faster filling compared to a normal valve stem.

The tube price you mentioned is clearly wrong. It's almost an order of magnitude too high. A seller on Ebay has an appropriate one for $32 and $11 shipping. I wonder if they didn't list a price for a tube-type TIRE.

I don't have thought on ballast type. I use plain water, so that when/if I get a puncture, there is no stickiness, environmental hazard, or other nuisance. It is also the cheapest. While it gets below freezing here, it is not cold or long enough to freeze that volume of water.

 

[lreops]

Thank you for all of the responses.

I re-looked for some prices and where I first found the $244.61 price was from Messicks ( http://www.messicks.com/partdetail/99424-27120.aspx ) from the part number in my parts manual.

I then starting looking at other places and found this ( http://www.kenjones.com/Scripts/ite...LINKS=XREF&XGID=TUBE_FRONTIMP_13.6x16&XGDESC= )

One thing that I was not aware of that was mentioned is the possibility that there is a difference between inter tubes for tubed and tubeless tires. Never heard this before. But I guess there must be some kind of explanation as to why there is such a price gap between these two places.

In any event, I'll probably just end up loading up my tubeless tires like many have said they have done with theirs.

Again, thanks for everyone's input.


Roin

 

[284 International]

They are showing the shipping weight as over 80 lbs. There must be a mislabeling or something else at work here. The tube isn't that heavy. That's an extremely low price for turf tires, though.

Whatever the situation, you will like the added traction of filled tires.

 

[Kytim]

I cross referenced the kubota part number in the post at another online parts vendor and it came back as a 16" wheel rim. Looks as someone must have made a data entry mistake.

 

[tiredguy]

Ron,
$240.00 for a 13.6-16 tube..WTF?
The only thing you're doing wrong is shopping in the wrong place...need to
drop your buddy Al an email on what you want. At $240.00 a piece he could
afford to hand deliver them!
Tired

 

[skeets]

Well guy I filled mine with used anti freez from a local scrap yard, called around and found one that sold the stuff for I think a buck a gallon,,bring your own container,,, and then pumped it into my tires,, I know some people think thats just nasty but at the cost of rim guard and other things it aint bad and as far as poluting the enviorment i figure the stuff is better in my tires than onthe ground

 

[lreops]

Ron,
$240.00 for a 13.6-16 tube..WTF?
The only thing you're doing wrong is shopping in the wrong place...need to
drop your buddy Al an email on what you want. At $240.00 a piece he could
afford to hand deliver them!
Tired

:Yeah, maybe I should of checked with you at CWT first, so seeing you treated me so fabulously in the past, Al. Maybe in my sub conscious I thought that I have given you such a work-out before that maybe you were still recovering. With that said, I can't tell you how much nicer it is to look at and ride on my Tractor with a "Real" rim as compared to what was on there to begin with .

As pointed out previously, that $244.61 price tag on Messick's site had to be a data entry error. It seems that the tube is actually around the $50.00 price range.

So, now that you have chimed in Al, what do you guys up there in the North country generally do for your customers when they load their Tractors, Tube or Tubeless? As mentioned earlier, just as long as the load is non-corrosive, tubeless should be alright. But......my thinking is that whatever you load, whether RimGuard, WWF, antifreeze, or just plain water, they all would have some corrosive effect on the exposed inner wheel surface that the load does not always completely cover. My next guess is that the amount of corrosion is probably negligible but over some time, it would have some effect.

The only reason I'm interested in this is because the one good rim I had was loaded in a tube. Of course this was with Calcium Chloride which is HIGHLY corrosive so I would suspect that was necessary to be in a tube to protect the inner rim.

It is quite evident that with a FEL, loading the tires is just about mandatory for the safest operation and I'm just gathering as much info as I can so that when I do this I'll leave no stone unturned.

Thanks again for everyone's thoughts.

Ron

 

[Machold]

I had mine loaded mine with Fusion (beet juice) whilst the B3030 was in for service (regulator, dynamo shot, replaced with alternator). Since the dealer was used to loading corrosive calcium chloride into tubes, I had the borscht added via TUBES. Not expensive.

 

[tiredguy]

Ron,
if you're going to re-use the chloride I'd put tubes in it to maintain the integrity of the rim. Rim Guard is the only product out there to my knowledge that won't cause corrosion.
The reason tubes are used in tube type tires is because tube type lack the additional layer of rubber inside to seal it from leaking. Also some rims especially years back had the centers rivited in so they weren't sealed like they are today. As a word of caution to anyone that has or is contemplating
buying a tractor whether used or new, if it does have tube type tires make sure that there's actually tubes inside the tires. I've seen many complaints of
tire failure and actually more often tires that deteriorate rapidly ( dry rot excessive cracking on new or fairly new tires ) caused because tubes were never installed from the factory when the tractor was brand new. Add liquid inside and it can "weep" through the porous innner liner and you end up with leaking problems and/or tire failure years before it should fail.

The most common case I've seen is on new Kubota's with 355/80D20 Bridgestone PD ( turf ) tires that often don't have tubes in them and the tires arte clearly marked "tube type". Think about it this way: imagine buying a brand new tractor and they never put grease in the transmission or rear end..eventually it's going to fail and we'd hear the difference because it's metal parts slowly being destroyed. With rubber there is no noise but you can be sure that it's still going to eventually come apart long before it should. When you add liquid ballast to a tube type tire that may or may not hold air properly, it will soon start to bleed or weep through from the inside out and a tire that can and does last much of the time 15 to 20 years, is shot inside of 2 or 3 easily.

So tubes inside tubeless tires if you're using chloride especially is a must do in my experience. In order for rust to happen exposure to the chemical that causes it to start still has to have oxygen for rust to occur. That's one of the major reasons for filling the tire 3/4 full as it keeps the rim completely submersed in liquid eliminating oxygen to get to the steel. The other probably most important reason is to keep the bottom end of the valve stem from corroding away and failing due to "valve wash". Liquid of any type running over anything over time will wear through it and we need to look no further than a creek or stream or anywhere along a road to see the effects of volumes of water running even off a road. Anything you can do to keep the oxygen out will stop rust whether inside a loaded tractor tire or the surface of the hood. Sand the paint off that nice hood and it will start rusting immediately without anything but exposure to air and of course there's moisture and oxygen everywhere.

Sorry I'll shut up and get off the soap box now LOL!
Al

 

[skeets]

Just jump right in Al,,, you might be supprised how much information you have put out there,, and some of us even learnt sumthin

 

[Kytim]

I think I learn something from Al everytime he posts. He really seems to know the tire business and isn't afraid to share his experiences and knowledge Keep up the good work!!!!

 

[Eric McCarthy]

With a name like Tiredguy and his vast knowledge of rubbers I don't think he's real sleepy!

 

[tiredguy]

I think I learn something from Al everytime he posts. He really seems to know the tire business and isn't afraid to share his experiences and knowledge Keep up the good work!!!!

LOL! I have some knowledge and opinions I can share and hopefully it's good or at least gets someone thinking a little more about the choices they make.
I appreciate all posts from everyone here that will share their experiences good and bad with hopes that we'll all learn something and best of all, avoid
making big expensive mistakes. Safety and saving money allows us all to enjoy our tractors to get the job done without problems.

I sure don't know everything even though I've been in the tire business for going on 41 years. The thing I always strive for is to me "smarter than a tire" . Some day I'm going to write a book with that title and it won't be just tires that will be in it. We could all get together and write one titled " smarter than a tractor" and could include the do's and don't's of servicing and operating and discover that "thinking first" will avoid us all lots of problems and in the long run and save us a whole bunch of money.

This reminds me of something my youngest son said to me while I was helping (holding his hand mostly) while changing an axle in his 4X4 truck. He was trying to break the axle nut loose and hadn't properly blocked the truck so it would be stable and just the slight movement prevented him from breaking it loose. I told him to re-block it in a certain way and finally he threw down the wrench and as he was walking to get some more wood blocks was mumbling under his breath. I asked him why he was so upset and he replied" "it just pisses me off when you're always right"! It was the perfect "ah ha" moment for me to teach him a life lesson. My reply was simply this: "son, it's not that I know so much it's because I've got 30 years more experience making mistakes" LOL! I told him that listening and researching would help him avoid mistakes which would make his life less miserable without the grief and aggravation and a whole lot more money left in his pocket.
Al

 

[skeets]

Kytim,, yeah Im always learning too,,, I just dont seem to retain it real long