D640 injection pump module replacement.

[Hal k]

Could someone discuss shims when putting new module in old g6200

 

[kubotafreak]

The shim is set based off deck height. So unless you have the deck milled you generally just reuse the old shim.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Yes, reuse all of the shims that were used with the old pump and the timing will be right.

 

[Dieseldonato]

Thats not the right way to do it. Your assuming the plungers are at the exact same height as the previous pump, or even if the pump was rebuilt the pkunher height stayed the same. Spill port timing is about the easiest way to check if the timing is correct. It can be done with simple hand tools and an old injection line. Basically with the injection line removed from the injector fuel will Spill past the plunger until it raises to the injection initiation height in the barrel. This is when the injection event starts, this is how you tell if it's timed right. Kubota was always very good at having a pointer and timing marks on the flywheel for this. Get a workshop manual it will detail the process.

 

[kubotafreak]

Thats not the right way to do it. Your assuming the plungers are at the exact same height as the previous pump, or even if the pump was rebuilt the pkunher height stayed the same. Spill port timing is about the easiest way to check if the timing is correct. It can be done with simple hand tools and an old injection line. Basically with the injection line removed from the injector fuel will Spill past the plunger until it raises to the injection initiation height in the barrel. This is when the injection event starts, this is how you tell if it's timed right. Kubota was always very good at having a pointer and timing marks on the flywheel for this. Get a workshop manual it will detail the process.

Not that I dissagree with your summation, but how do you propose to get adequate lift pressure so you can see the fuel drip. Also if the d640 is like my 650 the only adjustment is through pump height. Which again is set as built, and verified, but anymore than that unessesary. These low rpm engines are not driven on the road. Throttle response is not a priority. Its not an om617. Its actually one of those kinds of engines you should just be happy its that simple.

 

[Dieseldonato]

You basically just need some sort of flow to see it drip. Actually it should stream then stop. It's called spill port timing.
Please don't take this the wrong way, I'm not trying to insult your intelligence. You don't understand how a fuel system in a diesel works.
For lack of time to fully explain here is a decent article. You can skip down to the timing part.

A Guide to Injection Timing — What It Is and How to Adjust It | Diesel Pro Power

In this guide, we'll discuss how the process works, the benefits of making modifications and how to carry out adjustments on your own. Learn more!

dieselpro.com

The timing of the engine on kubotas is very easy to check, and also very important. I've set pumps up that required very different shim packs from what was under the old pump. It's easy to do and doesn't take any special tools. I will admit I do have some things I made up to make it easier, but working on diesel for most my adult life is different then setting up one pump.
Here is a video of a guy checking a D1105. It's very simple to do.

 

[kubotafreak]

You didnt insult my intelligence. But you didnt answer my question on how you would get adequate fuel lift pressure to conduct a spill test on this specific engine. Because only some of us are aware that depending on how much flow, vs drip varies wildly with the supply pressure.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Thats not the right way to do it. Your assuming the plungers are at the exact same height as the previous pump, or even if the pump was rebuilt the pkunher height stayed the same. Spill port timing is about the easiest way to check if the timing is correct. It can be done with simple hand tools and an old injection line. Basically with the injection line removed from the injector fuel will Spill past the plunger until it raises to the injection initiation height in the barrel. This is when the injection event starts, this is how you tell if it's timed right. Kubota was always very good at having a pointer and timing marks on the flywheel for this. Get a workshop manual it will detail the process.

I respectfully, yet still completely disagree.
I've set up a lot of Kubota engines, IDI and DI, and I've never had one that was off because of a pump change.
I've had a ton off them that were off because someone thought they knew what they were doing and pulled or added shims to bump up their power.

Maybe if you use a Chinese knock of injection pump then it might be wise to do a spill test.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

You didnt insult my intelligence. But you didnt answer my question on how you would get adequate fuel lift pressure to conduct a spill test on this specific engine. Because only some of us are aware that depending on how much flow, vs drip varies wildly with the supply pressure.

You don't need any pressure to do a spill test, you can even do it without anything attached to the injection pump delivery valves.
It's only a small amount of fuel that gets "spilled".

 

[whitetiger]

I respectfully, yet still completely disagree.
I've set up a lot of Kubota engines, IDI and DI, and I've never had one that was off because of a pump change.
I've had a ton off them that were off because someone thought they knew what they were doing and pulled or added shims to bump up their power.

Maybe if you use a Chinese knock of injection pump then it might be wise to do a spill test.

You are correct. The Kubota engine training and the Kubota Industrial engine classes all tell you to reuse the same shims unless someone has been experimenting with them.

 

[Dieseldonato]

They must have changed their training, we were told to always verify timing when doing a pump change. It takes all of 5 minutes to set up to do it, another 5 to preform the test. Longer if shims need to be changed, but that doesn't take long either.

 

[Dieseldonato]

You didnt insult my intelligence. But you didnt answer my question on how you would get adequate fuel lift pressure to conduct a spill test on this specific engine. Because only some of us are aware that depending on how much flow, vs drip varies wildly with the supply pressure.

As Wolfman has said it just needs fuel to flow out of it, even a gravity fed tank is good enough. It's an open or closed thing, really no in-between. More pressure makes it more apparent, but also makes a bigger mess. I have a little electric fuel pump I used if the tank was bellow the engine. Was a Fawcett brand 4psi. Rarely had to use it.

 

[whitetiger]

It takes all of 5 minutes to set up to do it, another 5 to preform the test.

Famous last words, a lot of applications you will spend hours gaining access to the timing window.

 

[Dieseldonato]

Famous last words, a lot of applications you will spend hours gaining access to the timing window.

Your machine you do what you want. It's doesn't take long to do.

 

[whitetiger]

Your machine you do what you want. It's doesn't take long to do.

Only about 12 hours on a Kubota SCL1000.