6" Wheel Spacers. What's likely to break?

[TheOldHokie]

"Mighty heavy," perhaps, but made of aluminum on the OP's 2910.

SDT

As is my B7200 which has very wide wheel spacing and has also been badly overloaded. The axle extension on it is currently over 7" each side and can go another inch or two. I was trying to match the CG on the 9N and probably got pretty close.

Let me know when you find a Kubota axle housing that has grenaded and sent the tractor tumbling. I will be interested in knowing how that happened. Would not want to repeat the mistake.

Dan

 

[SDT]

As is my B7200 which has very wide wheel spacing and has also been badly overloaded. The axle extension on it is currently over 7" each side and can go another inch or two. I was trying to match the CG on the 9N and probably got pretty close.

Let me know when you find a Kubota axle housing that has grenaded and sent the tractor tumbling. I will be interested in knowing how that happened. Would not want to repeat the mistake.

Dan

Let me know when you are certain that it cannot happen.

Perhaps, I will then get some 6" spacers for use on my hillsides. Would like to make my Kubotas more stable on hillsides.

OP asked opinions regarding likely failure mechanisms. I answered and stand by my opinion.

SDT

 

[NCL4701]

Ford N-series tractors do have a very low CG which is a major plus on side hill stability. But they are also two wheel drive tractors with horribly high gearing, no live hydraulics requiring you to constantly operate the clutch, a parking brake that is a joke, and abysmal down hill stopping power. All of that combined makes them difficult to operate at a safe speed and a major runaway threat on slopes. When your tractor loses traction and starts to slide down a hill out of control the low center of gravity offers scant protection for a collision, unpleasant trip over a precipice, and/or rollover caused by getting sideways at high speed.

How do you stop a runaway Ford 9N? See picture. The dent in the hood was not too big and I could pound it out with a big hammer. The radiator is a replacement and the grille and right side panel are a mangled mess in the scrap bin. Basically I had a choice between a tree or a cliff. I chose the tree.

That was not the first or last grassy sled ride that tractor has given me and ultimately I decided if I was going to continue to live on this hillside it was in my best interest to buy a tractor with better gearing, a reliable parking brake, 4wd traction for down hill braking, and a 3pt lift that I could safely operate. If anybody wants to come by I will let them take the 8N with a 72" finish mower on the back for a little test drive over the circuit I mow. Then youcan tale the bush hog up on the hill and try your hand at thicket clearing and let me know what they think. If you are accustomed to the control and comfort level you get with a "high CG" 4WD Kubota you better wear brown pants.

I grew up with an 8N tractor and the fond memories the evoke have given them a permanent place in my heart. I was probably first in the seat around two - with grandparental assistance of course. But the simple reality is that of all of the different tractors both 2WD and 4wd I have operated over the last 70+ years they are the least safe on hills. Two deaths and a bunch of broken ribs in my family alone.

Dan

View attachment 74724

Ran a 2N/8N/9N junkyard combination from 8 years old until 2 years ago. It has a Ferguson hood that was custom fitted with a very large hammer but the guts are a N. Ran a Farmall H row crop (the one referenced and shown in earlier post in this thread) from about 15 years old until a couple years ago. The N is much better on slopes than the H but that’s not saying much. The L4701 replaced both functionally but unlikely I’ll ever get rid of the H and Ford.

Agree fully with your assessment. There’s more to safety than CG. If you decide to run a rotary cutter with a N you’ll need an over run clutch for the PTO if you intend to ever stop. If you decide to side slope mow areas with a N too steep for your Kubota, good luck to you.

Some things can’t safely be mowed with a farm/utility tractor. Something specific to slopes, such as a Ventrac will do more but everything has its limits. We have 3 tractors and a bush hog but I mow the dam (below) with a Stihl FS-70. The rock pit for the tail race at the bottom isn’t conducive to up/down mowing and it isn’t as smooth as it looks in the photo. Might be someone would mow it with a tractor? I ain’t risking my life over grass.

Whatever you do, good luck and stay safe.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Let me know when you are certain that it cannot happen.

Perhaps, I will then get some 6" spacers for use on my hillsides. Would like to make my Kubotas more stable on hillsides.

OP asked opinions regarding likely failure mechanisms. I answered and stand by my opinion.

SDT

As did/do I. I made it perfectly clear in my initial post that nobody here can reliably answer that question. I followed with some real life failures brought on by overloading as possible outcomes. They were real not imagined.

I already made my personal chouce when I opted for 2" spacers on the L3901. I based that decision on the calculations and rational I also offered earlier. I will leave the testing of 6" spacers up to someone else.

Dan

 

[SDT]

Ran a 2N/8N/9N junkyard combination from 8 years old until 2 years ago. It has a Ferguson hood that was custom fitted with a very large hammer but the guts are a N. Ran a Farmall H row crop (the one referenced and shown in earlier post in this thread) from about 15 years old until a couple years ago. The N is much better on slopes than the H but that’s not saying much. The L4701 replaced both functionally but unlikely I’ll ever get rid of the H and Ford.

Agree fully with your assessment. There’s more to safety than CG. If you decide to run a rotary cutter with a N you’ll need an over run clutch for the PTO if you intend to ever stop. If you decide to side slope mow areas with a N too steep for your Kubota, good luck to you.

Some things can’t safely be mowed with a farm/utility tractor. Something specific to slopes, such as a Ventrac will do more but everything has its limits. We have 3 tractors and a bush hog but I mow the dam (below) with a Stihl FS-70. The rock pit for the tail race at the bottom isn’t conducive to up/down mowing and it isn’t as smooth as it looks in the photo. Might be someone would mow it with a tractor? I ain’t risking my life over grass.

Whatever you do, good luck and stay safe. View attachment 74739

Agreed, but the thread is about hillside stability rather than overall operational safety. Accordingly, I limited my opinion to the question asked by the OP.

" So I am wondering what might fail if I went to the full 6" spacer on each side. The goal is maximum side slope stability. I just need 1" spacers for chain clearance I think. "

I, too, could relate real world anecdotes but choose to not do so because such are neither persuasive nor of particular usefulness.

SDT

 

[SDT]

As did/do I. I made it perfectly clear in my initial post that nobody here can reliably answer that question. I followed with some real life failures brought on by overloading as possible outcomes. They were real not imagined.

I already made my personal chouce when I opted for 2" spacers on the L3901. I based that decision on the calculations and rational I also offered earlier. I will leave the testing of 6" spacers up to someone else.

Dan

Fair enough.

In any event, the thread has likely outlived its usefulness to the OP.

SDT

 

[NCL4701]

Agreed, but the thread is about hillside stability rather than overall operational safety. Accordingly, I limited my opinion to the question asked by the OP.

" So I am wondering what might fail if I went to the full 6" spacer on each side. The goal is maximum side slope stability. I just need 1" spacers for chain clearance I think. "

I, too, could relate real world anecdotes but choose to not do so because such are neither persuasive nor of particular usefulness.

SDT

Real world experience running a N for a few thousand hours over 47 years in all manner of conditions isn’t useful to considering the practical use of a N. OK. If experience isn’t useful or persuasive about 90% of the posts on this forum aren’t useful or persuasive. And unless I mis-read, you didn’t suggest the OP actually get a N to mow slopes, so my comment wasn’t directed to anything you said.

However, another commenter said, “Maybe get a Ford N series or an A-C G, They'll be super stable on the slope.” That’s not a comment limited to hillside stability, it’s a suggestion to purchase a N as a slope mower. So far as the suggestion to consider an Allis Chalmers G, I said nothing, and will say nothing, as I have no experience using a G on slopes.

I fully agree with your next post. The thread has run its course. Unwatching.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

an option...
Instead of risking life and limb for cutting a hillside of GRASS, replace grass with low growing vegetation. 100% SAFE and ZERO maintenance. Lots of choice for replacements, based on where you live. Yes, it may take 2-5 years to fully cover the slope but you'll gain a LOT of 'free' time and NO hospital visits !

 

[SDT]

Real world experience running a N for a few thousand hours over 47 years in all manner of conditions isn’t useful to considering the practical use of a N. OK. If experience isn’t useful or persuasive about 90% of the posts on this forum aren’t useful or persuasive. And unless I mis-read, you didn’t suggest the OP actually get a N to mow slopes, so my comment wasn’t directed to anything you said.

However, another commenter said, “Maybe get a Ford N series or an A-C G, They'll be super stable on the slope.” That’s not a comment limited to hillside stability, it’s a suggestion to purchase a N as a slope mower. So far as the suggestion to consider an Allis Chalmers G, I said nothing, and will say nothing, as I have no experience using a G on slopes.

I fully agree with your next post. The thread has run its course. Unwatching.

" Real world experience running a N for a few thousand hours over 47 years in all manner of conditions isn’t useful to considering the practical use of a N. "

Nowhere did I say that. Indeed, I have over 50 years of operational experience with N series tractors, much such experience mowing steep ground. Of course, such experience is useful and valuable.

Rather, I stated that anecdotes, i.e., anecdotal evidence is neither persuasive nor of particular usefulness.

SDT

 

[NCL4701]

" Real world experience running a N for a few thousand hours over 47 years in all manner of conditions isn’t useful to considering the practical use of a N. "

Nowhere did I say that. Indeed, I have over 50 years of operational experience with N series tractors, much such experience mowing steep ground. Of course, such experience is useful and valuable.

Rather, I stated that anecdotes, i.e., anecdotal evidence is neither persuasive nor of particular usefulness.

SDT

I know what you said. I have no difficulty reading. And in the context you said it, the message conveyed was quite clear. Subsequent lawyering doesn’t modify that.

No offense taken. You don’t know me and have no real reason to respect me or anything I say here or elsewhere. I respect that and am fine with it. All is well, at least on my side of it.

If I’m truly misconstruing your meaning then the only alternative is we’re talking but not communicating. Either way, I’m done with it.

If you want the last word, I’ll let you have it. I’m done.

 

[DustyRusty]

Commercial Zero Turn Slope Mower| Pro Z 972 SD | Cub Cadet US

Find parts and product manuals for your PRO Z 972 SD. Free shipping on parts orders over $45.

www.cubcadet.com

 

[SDT]

I know what you said. I have no difficulty reading. And in the context you said it, the message conveyed was quite clear. Subsequent lawyering doesn’t modify that.

No offense taken. You don’t know me and have no real reason to respect me or anything I say here or elsewhere. I respect that and am fine with it. All is well, at least on my side of it.

If I’m truly misconstruing your meaning then the only alternative is we’re talking but not communicating. Either way, I’m done with it.

If you want the last word, I’ll let you have it. I’m done.

I take responsibility for the miscommunication.

The comment about anecdotes was in response to another poster's comments. For the sake of brevity and convenience I chose to include it in my response to your post thinking the intent would be obvious. My time spent in tractor forums is nearly always measured in seconds.

Apologies for the confusion that was unintentional yet understandable.

Enough said.

SDT

 

[SDT]

Commercial Zero Turn Slope Mower| Pro Z 972 SD | Cub Cadet US

Find parts and product manuals for your PRO Z 972 SD. Free shipping on parts orders over $45.

www.cubcadet.com

A year or so ago at a dealer, I saw a small, tracked remote controlled mower designed for use on steep ground. Very low CG and designed such that rollovers would result in little damage to the machine.

Both interesting and expensive.

SDT

 

[GreensvilleJay]

still figure it's cheaper replace grass with something else.....
..though an autonomus hovercutter would be interesting to build and see in operation

 

[Henro]

Fair enough.

In any event, the thread has likely outlived its usefulness to the OP.

SDT

Perhaps, but one thing I find when trying to learn on internet forums is that many times opinions are given, without specifics to back them up.

For example, who can argue that increasing the lever arm of the axle will not put more stress on things inside the gear case housing? Common sense says this has to be true.

BUT how many transmission housings are actually broken, or bearings destroyed, or axles broken by adding wheel spacers? Unfortunately nobody knows it seems. Certainly these things do happen, even when nothing is changed from stock on a tractor.

So it seems we speculate. And in the end make the best guess as to what benefits us, and what the risk might be.

This thread has helped me to be in a better position to make my best guess. AND at this point, my best guess will probably not be 6" spacers. Thinking now 4"...or 3".