L2501H Shuts off when I stand up off seat ? Safety Switch ?

[Up_&_Running]

Hi all, first post here. Ive got a 1 year old machine, that shuts down, when I lift my butt off the seat, its got a 150hrs on it, this started around 100hrs of operation.

Ive played with the rocker pedal " nuetral " switch and the PTO switch, and those interlocks are working correctly, or at least partially correctly. Im geussing one of these switches is 2 switches in one, maybe open and closed at the same time, and one side has failed ?

My warranty has expired, so I thought Id shop this through here so see if any know of the solution. I did talk to a tech a the franchise I bought the machine at, he told me there was no " known " problem or regular failure in this particular case. Im a light truck powertrain/standby genny mechanic ( not tech, dating myself there ! ), anyhow, I can fix this thing, if I had schematics or a little direction to go.

I did buy an original factory shop manual, supposed to be in my mailbox today, hoping it has some flow charts and maybe come schematics. Im a little concerened about the manual, everything I could find for sale has a copyright of 2014, and coming from the automotive/truck world, I cant believe that things dont get updated from year to year ? I know they dont consider model years with tractors, but I believe my tractor was built 5yrs after the shop manual was printed.

This needs to be fixed, for Im wearing out the starter/starter ring, Im on and off the tractor ALLOT.

Thanks for any input !

 

[nbking]

It's your operator presence safety switch. Working as it should.

 

[Dave_eng]

Lugbolt, one of the forum's most knowledgeable posted the following recently.

You will have to decide if it might apply to your L

Lugbolt on reading safety switches in codes.

I'm familiar with these things

first is the hourmeter showing any codes (P0606, etc)? If so, call the dealer. There isn't much you can do to them beyond basic stuff...everything else, requires kubota software and hardware.



No codes? Ok do this......



with the key OFF, hold down both of the buttons on the left side of the dash, both at the same time...for a few seconds. Then turn the key on. Look at your hourmeter it should say "A". Let off of those two buttons now. Now, push and hold the RIGHT button, and you'll hear a beep and the hourmeter lcd should show something like 1with a number following 1. Pay no attention to that, when you see 1: let off the right button and don't touch it no more. At this point you can AUDIBLY test every single safety switch's operation. They are all on-off switches. HST pedal switch. Move the pedal forward from neutral and you should hear a beep. Let it return to neutral and once it hits neutral you will hear a beep again. Repeat for reverse, then let it return to neutral, should beep. That lets you know the hst neutral switch is working properly. NO beep? Switch wire is off or switch is bad (two likeliest issues). Repeat for pto switch. engine off for all of the tests. Turn the pto "on" you outta hear a beep. Turn it off and it outta beep again. NO beeps, your pto switch is not sensing an on or off condition check wiring and check the switch to make sure one of them didn't fall off. Repeat again for hi-low range or forward-reverse shifter. Outta beep when it comes out of neutral. Repeat again for seat switch, outta beep when ou get out of the seat. Only other switch would be for parking brake and it is not on the start circuit. Neither is the seat switch. It should at least crank over regardless of whether you're on the seat or not. Once your done playing with the beeper and you have isolated your issue, turn the key off and fix your issue. When you restart, the hourmeter will return to normal.

Dave

 

[GeoHorn]

The seat safety switch is designed to confirm you are properly seated in order to operate the tractor.
The lawyers will go nuts over it….but if you want to disable it… look under your seat, find the connector, unplug it, and “jumper” across the pins…. and then you should be able to start the engine and it should be capable of continuing to run when you get off the seat.

 

[Roadworthy]

A one year old Kubota should still be on warranty. If the tractor is stopped and your HST safety switch thinks you're not moving you should be able to stand up. You have two seconds or something like that to flip the seat up and the engine should continue running. If the tractor is moving you cannot stand up and keep the tractor running. Flipping up the seat is so you can run a stationary PTO implement like a wood chipper.

 

[Up_&_Running]

It's your operator presence safety switch. Working as it should.

Thanks, used to be if the machine was idling, machine was stopped, foot not near pedal, PTO not engaged, I used to be able to get off the tractor, and the engine would stay running indefinitely.

Not the case anymore, I can get off the seat, and flip the seat forward and it continues to idle, but for the first 100 hours, I could stop and get off, and it would continue to idle ( without the seat flip forward ).

I thought the flip of the seat was specifically overriding the PTO safety switch, so the pto could be engaged when no operator was present.

So now the question is, was it broke before ? and now its working correctly ?

So to be clear, is this thing supposed to " shut off " if I pull my butt of the seat ?

Thanks for the replies !

 

[Up_&_Running]

Lugbolt, one of the forum's most knowledgeable posted the following recently.

You will have to decide if it might apply to your L

Lugbolt on reading safety switches in codes.

I'm familiar with these things

first is the hourmeter showing any codes (P0606, etc)? If so, call the dealer. There isn't much you can do to them beyond basic stuff...everything else, requires kubota software and hardware.



No codes? Ok do this......



with the key OFF, hold down both of the buttons on the left side of the dash, both at the same time...for a few seconds. Then turn the key on. Look at your hourmeter it should say "A". Let off of those two buttons now. Now, push and hold the RIGHT button, and you'll hear a beep and the hourmeter lcd should show something like 1with a number following 1. Pay no attention to that, when you see 1: let off the right button and don't touch it no more. At this point you can AUDIBLY test every single safety switch's operation. They are all on-off switches. HST pedal switch. Move the pedal forward from neutral and you should hear a beep. Let it return to neutral and once it hits neutral you will hear a beep again. Repeat for reverse, then let it return to neutral, should beep. That lets you know the hst neutral switch is working properly. NO beep? Switch wire is off or switch is bad (two likeliest issues). Repeat for pto switch. engine off for all of the tests. Turn the pto "on" you outta hear a beep. Turn it off and it outta beep again. NO beeps, your pto switch is not sensing an on or off condition check wiring and check the switch to make sure one of them didn't fall off. Repeat again for hi-low range or forward-reverse shifter. Outta beep when it comes out of neutral. Repeat again for seat switch, outta beep when ou get out of the seat. Only other switch would be for parking brake and it is not on the start circuit. Neither is the seat switch. It should at least crank over regardless of whether you're on the seat or not. Once your done playing with the beeper and you have isolated your issue, turn the key off and fix your issue. When you restart, the hourmeter will return to normal.

Dave

Thanks for this, my unit does not have a brain or switches on the dash,... its apparently old school.

 

[Up_&_Running]

A one year old Kubota should still be on warranty. If the tractor is stopped and your HST safety switch thinks you're not moving you should be able to stand up. You have two seconds or something like that to flip the seat up and the engine should continue running. If the tractor is moving you cannot stand up and keep the tractor running. Flipping up the seat is so you can run a stationary PTO implement like a wood chipper.

The one year warranty is up, I was busy with life and should have gotten it to the dealer, but its a 45 mile ride one way, and I just never got around to it. Yes, it does the seat flip, continue to run, but it used to idle indefinitely if it was not moving and you got off the seat.

 

[tthorkil]

From the symptoms that you are describing, I am guessing that either your HST pedal is not returning entirely to neutral or the safety switch on the pedal is malfunctioning. Try lubricating(greasing- I believe that there should be a grease zerk) the pivot point of the HST pedal. I believe that there is an adjustment of the position of the safety switch also.

 

[Up_&_Running]

From the symptoms that you are describing, I am guessing that either your HST pedal is not returning entirely to neutral or the safety switch on the pedal is malfunctioning. Try lubricating(greasing- I believe that there should be a grease zerk) the pivot point of the HST pedal. I believe that there is an adjustment of the position of the safety switch also.

thanks, I will give that a try, lubing and checking. I think it might be working, for if I roll in either direction and try to start it, it wont, as soon as it returns to center I can start it up. I think I did lube at 100hrs, but will get under it again.

I was thinking that one or all of these safety switches are likely built in two circuit capacity ( NO/NC in each switch ), likely for no other reason than to keep you from defeating them and one of my switches is " half " failed. Making it difficult to diagnose shooting from the " hip ".

It seems to me, I worked on skid steer that had a dual seat switch like that.

 

[TheOldHokie]

From the symptoms that you are describing, I am guessing that either your HST pedal is not returning entirely to neutral or the safety switch on the pedal is malfunctioning. Try lubricating(greasing- I believe that there should be a grease zerk) the pivot point of the HST pedal. I believe that there is an adjustment of the position of the safety switch also.

If the same as the L3901 there are two switches - the HST pedal position and the PTO engaged switch. You should be able to leave the seat as long as the HST is in neutral and the PTO is disengaged.

Dan

 

[Up_&_Running]

If the same as the L3901 there are two switches - the HST pedal position and the PTO engaged switch. You should be able to leave the seat as long as the HST is in neutral and the PTO is disengaged.

Dan

Yes, that is how it worked, when I bought it, as long at the pto is not engaged, and the rocker pedal finds it neutral, thanks for confirming for me, was starting to wonder if Ive lost my mind ( again ! ).

 

[Up_&_Running]

Ok, since I started this thread this morning, the mail has come and in it, I received Kubota 9Y131-11210. This was money well spent,... found this,..

HST Type This tractor is equipped with Operator Presence Control (OPC) system which automatically stops the engine when operator stands up from the seat while shifting the PTO lever or the HST pedal. The system is controlled by a seat switch (13), OPC timer (11), key stop solenoid relay (9), key stop solenoid (8), PTO neutral switch (14), (15) and HST switch (16), (17).

 

[Up_&_Running]

So for any that come behind me, this thing is supposed to idle with no operator in the seat ( pedal @ neutral, PTO not engaged ).

Looks like the seat safety switch itself has 5 different values, so there is no jumping this thing out.. the switch runs around $60 in 2021. The OE manual tells you how it all works, but really has no diagnostic routines to repair it, you kinda got to figure out the schematics. The seat switch also needs to be " in adjustment " ( values of degrees ), which would be the low hanging fruit to pick first, make sure its in adjustment before pinning out the values of the switch.

Im gonna make a guess, that its the seat switch, when I can find some shade later Im going to check/pin out.

Thanks for all the input !!

 

[TheOldHokie]

Ok, since I started this thread this morning, the mail has come and in it, I received Kubota 9Y131-11210. This was money well spent,... found this,..

So for any that come behind me, this thing is supposed to idle with no operator in the seat ( pedal @ neutral, PTO not engaged ).

Looks like the seat safety has 5 different values, so there is no jumping this thing out.. the switch runs around $60 in 2021. The OE manual tells you how it all works, but really has no diagnostic routines to repair it, you kinda got to figure out the schematics. The seat switch also needs to be " in adjustment " ( values of degrees ), which would be the low hanging fruit to pick first, make sure its in adjustment before pinning out the values of the switch.

Im gonna make a guess, that its the seat switch, when I can find some shade later Im going to check/pin out.

Thanks for all the input !!

FWIW I had an issue @10 hours where the engine shut off as soon as I moved the HST pedal. After the initial panic I remembered I had been working under the seat. Flipped it up and found I had left a wrench there. Just enough obstruction to raise the seat enough to trigger that interlock. Might want to look hard at that adjustment.

Dan

 

[Jim L.]

I'm not looking at your schematic, but the double switches usually have one switch hot, and the twin switch ground. Jumpering the switches at random will blow fuses. You'll need that schematic for the pin-outs.

The seat switch would seem to be working since when you get up the engine kills itself. This would point to the PTO switch(es) or the pedal switch(es). More often it is a matter of mechanical adjustment to the switches than a switch electrical failure.

I would first leave the switches in physical place, disconnect the cable, and watch with a meter or light when the switches open and close.

 

[whitetiger]

Thanks for this, my unit does not have a brain or switches on the dash,... its apparently old school.

The L2501 has a mechanical injection engine so there are no ReGen switchs.

 

[jameister]

Thanks, used to be if the machine was idling, machine was stopped, foot not near pedal, PTO not engaged, I used to be able to get off the tractor, and the engine would stay running indefinitely.

Not the case anymore, I can get off the seat, and flip the seat forward and it continues to idle, but for the first 100 hours, I could stop and get off, and it would continue to idle ( without the seat flip forward ).

I thought the flip of the seat was specifically overriding the PTO safety switch, so the pto could be engaged when no operator was present.

So now the question is, was it broke before ? and now its working correctly ?

So to be clear, is this thing supposed to " shut off " if I pull my butt of the seat ?

Thanks for the replies !

read your manual.

there are two or three such safety situations: off the seat, can't start with PTO engaged, read the manual.

 

[nbryan]

Does your tractor have a park brake lever sensor switch behind the dash?

My B2650 needs to have the parking brake pedal engaged and locked with the lever down, in order for the PTO to run while the seat is empty. There's a switch behind the dashboard cover where the park brake lever is, that latches in place when you hold the lever down with foot on brakes and release the brake pedal BEFORE letting go of the lever. It will then hold.

I had the same issue with the tractor quitting as I got off the seat with the pto engaged for the chipper. No hand brake latched, no get off seat. But the engaged hand brake wasn't keeping it going anymore either.

I discovered the solution when I manually and firmly held the park brake lock lever down by hand with the PTO engaged and stood up off the seat. It continued running. But using the brake lock lever without added down pressure (remove hand pressure) and it quit when I stood up.

I'll dig back a few months for the photos I took to show what what wrong.

There's an adjustment for the brake lever sensing switch that was way out of adjustment. This happened after I did a 600 hour maintenance and adjusted the brake pedals tighter to their minimum pedal travel spec. It made the switch button behind the dash not contact the brake lever anymore when lever engaged in park. 2 full turns downward of the switch adjustment screw brought the switch into contact and full effect when the brakes were on and locked, and now the engine runs with pto on and me off the seat!

Did this ever work???

B2620 PTO safety switch function ?

www.orangetractortalks.com

 

[whitetiger]

Does your tractor have a park brake lever sensor switch behind the dash?

My B2650 needs to have the parking brake pedal engaged and locked with the lever down, in order for the PTO to run while the seat is empty. There's a switch behind the dashboard cover where the park brake lever is, that latches in place when you hold the lever down with foot on brakes and release the brake pedal BEFORE letting go of the lever. It will then hold.

I had the same issue with the tractor quitting as I got off the seat with the pto engaged for the chipper. No hand brake latched, no get off seat. But the engaged hand brake wasn't keeping it going anymore either.

I discovered the solution when I manually and firmly held the park brake lock lever down by hand with the PTO engaged and stood up off the seat. It continued running. But using the brake lock lever without added down pressure (remove hand pressure) and it quit when I stood up.

I'll dig back a few months for the photos I took to show what what wrong.

There's an adjustment for the brake lever sensing switch that was way out of adjustment. This happened after I did a 600 hour maintenance and adjusted the brake pedals tighter to their minimum pedal travel spec. It made the switch button behind the dash not contact the brake lever anymore when lever engaged in park. 2 full turns downward of the switch adjustment screw brought the switch into contact and full effect when the brakes were on and locked, and now the engine runs with pto on and me off the seat!

Did this ever work???

B2620 PTO safety switch function ?

www.orangetractortalks.com

There is a Park Brake switch on an L01 series, but no Brake Light switch.