First post, please be gentle with me.. Fuel Starvation?

[cpumechanic]

I have a 1990's vintage B2100 with the 3 cylinder diesel lookup says D1005-D10 engine.

I have owned the tractor for about 5 years , and have changed oil, filters, fuel filters, and just started using off road diesel in the rig.
It was used hard in December to snow blow 2 foot of snow off a 700 foot long driveway. No issues... worked/ran fine.

Winter is over, and I installed the box blade on the rear 3-pt hitch to move some top soil around and again it ran perfect for about 15 minutes, the suddenly started to die.. and now will start but it appears that only 1 cylinder is running, and it refuses to rev up at all. This was a sudden change. Oil level is fine, air filter is clean, pulled fuel filter and it looked good, and with it removed the fuel flows in a nice flow with the fuel valve open. So.. it appears to have fuel flow (at least to the filter on the lower RHS of the engine).

Since it starts, but barely runs , just sputters.. I am guessing fuel pump has failed? Or do others have other ideas on things to check.

Unit has about 700 hours and is not used hard, mostly to drag the box blade once a year, and to mow with the 60 inch belly mower.

I located the factory service manuals for this exact model B2100, and have started looking at the troubleshooting steps.

Suggestions anyone on what to check next? I don't want to just throw new parts at it.

Thank you in advance

CPU

 

[D2Cat]

Do you have a fuel container from a boat (or something similar) you could use to feed fuel to the engine? Just connect to the fuel line coming out of the fuel pump. If the hose is long enough you can have the fuel tank so it gravity feeds. You can then tell if the pump is not working.

 

[BigG]

Replace the fuel filter. One that looks good may not be letting fuel pass thru it. I would also add some algicide to the fuel. Also look where the fuel line goes into the top of the fuel filter. There are some small openings that may get plugged. So blow them out or you may need to manually clean the small screen that is in the top of some fuel filters.

 

[je1279]

Yeah I would start with draining the fuel, replacing the filter, and adding fresh fuel along with an algicide treatment as @BigG suggested. If that solves your problem, it was as easy as bad/contaminated fuel or a clogged fuel filter.

 

[GeoHorn]

Did you bleed the fuel injection system?

 

[cpumechanic]

Hello
Thanks to all for the replies, I agree, I am going to drain the fuel, and replace the fuel filter. I can also experiment with the gravity feed from external tank.. and clean the screens in the fuel filter. I can also ad some algecide as suggested.
So.. it sounds like folks agree that if the engine was running fine for years, and suddenly starts sputtering, barely running on one cylinder, and RPM will not increase when the likely cause is fuel starvation....

I was reading the workshop service manual WSM... and I had to laugh when it insisted that the entire rubber fuel lines needed to be replaced every 2 years.. Does anyone do that.. I would never think that is needed and this is a 1990 vintage diesel with I am sure the original rubber fuel hoses are still present.

I'll tear into it tomorrow, and be sure to replace the one fuel filter....looking at the WSM the first low pressure fuel feed pump that feeds the high pressure pump is mechanical with a diaphram.. perhaps that diaphram has failed.. we shall see.

Thanks again.. I got used to walking out and using this.. for years.. with no issues.. pretty surprised it let me down today.

CPU

 

[19thSF]

Your problem sure does sound like fuel starvation. Before you do anything else, try this. Blow out the fuel cap. Yup, give it a good cleaning. I had a similar problem some time ago. Got some good "long shot" advise, and sure enough it was a clogged cap. No air getting into the tank creates a vacuum, and then no fuel gets out of the tank.

Good luck with your problem.

 

[mendonsy]

I doubt that all the fuel hoses need to be replaced, but it would be a good idea to carefully check them over. A few years ago I had a very small split in the fuel hose between the filter and lift pump on my B7500 which let the air into the injector pump. There wasn't any pressure at that point so it didn't leak fuel which made that split difficult to find.

 

[cpumechanic]

Hello

Is bleeding the fuel system what you mean?
Run the engine for 30 seconds then shut down, as per wsm attached? The engine barely runs when started, and I can do that...and that and bleeding the steering is the only bleeding I can find when searching the WSM.

 

[cpumechanic]

Your problem sure does sound like fuel starvation. Before you do anything else, try this. Blow out the fuel cap. Yup, give it a good cleaning. I had a similar problem some time ago. Got some good "long shot" advise, and sure enough it was a clogged cap. No air getting into the tank creates a vacuum, and then no fuel gets out of the tank.

Good luck with your problem.

Hello... I did try starting running with the fuel cap off yesterday, didn't appear to make any difference. Will replace the fuel filter , look at fuel lines carefully, drain all fuel, replace with fresh, add some fuel treatment/algecide and then cross my fingers it helps and report back. Oil was at top of mark on stick, and black as coal but I believe that is normal for a diesel engine.. no evidence of any oil lamp or low oil. Needs change at start of season, but that's it.

Again this unit is never used hard mostly for mowing , and only has 700 hours on it, stored indoors... so I don't abuse it.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

hmmm.... and just started using off road diesel in the rig.

so the problem occoured AFTER putting 'cheaper' diesel in it ?
sigh.......

it took me 3 dayze(on and off) to fix my BX23S fuel problem( plastic bit in tank plugged outlet...)

in you case ,for sure ,drain tank, new filters,fresh $$ diesel,recharge battery...get her running....AFTER that, then add algecide/stabilizer as you seldom run it.You should run at least once a month( take it for a spin) for say 1/2 hour,just to keep things lubed,charge battery, etc.

 

[19thSF]

Hello... I did try starting running with the fuel cap off yesterday, didn't appear to make any difference. Will replace the fuel filter , look at fuel lines carefully, drain all fuel, replace with fresh, add some fuel treatment/algecide and then cross my fingers it helps and report back. Oil was at top of mark on stick, and black as coal but I believe that is normal for a diesel engine.. no evidence of any oil lamp or low oil. Needs change at start of season, but that's it.

Again this unit is never used hard mostly for mowing , and only has 700 hours on it, stored indoors... so I don't abuse it.

Well, you have gotten some good advice, and you seem to know what you are doing mechanically. Again, good luck with this. Please let us know how it turned out. It all adds to the "knowledge base". I am going out to plow soon. I am not supposed to have to do that on April 16th in lovely Southern New England.
YIKES

 

[cpumechanic]

hmmm.... and just started using off road diesel in the rig.

so the problem occoured AFTER putting 'cheaper' diesel in it ?
sigh.......

it took me 3 dayze(on and off) to fix my BX23S fuel problem( plastic bit in tank plugged outlet...)

in you case ,for sure ,drain tank, new filters,fresh $$ diesel,recharge battery...get her running....AFTER that, then add algecide/stabilizer as you seldom run it.You should run at least once a month( take it for a spin) for say 1/2 hour,just to keep things lubed,charge battery, etc.

Hi

Just to be clear.. this is my second or third tank of off road diesel.. and no issues from same sunoco gas station supplier on the first two tanks.. but I agree.. I can go to the truck stop and get the good stuff and use that to avoid this is the future.... I work on a lot of different stuff and can usually get things going.

Can anyone comment about how to "bleed the injectors" as suggested.. I searched the entire PDF service manual for the term bleed, and the attached is all I found related to fuel.. I see other posts about opening some kind of port on the high pressure pump.. but I also notice folks messing up that $1000+ pump so I would want to be very careful before I start messing with that.

Thanks again for all the support/feedback.. I will surely post what the final fix is if I can get it running again.

On the way to the dealer to buy the correct fuel filter.

 

[cpumechanic]

Ok.. got a great deal at local dealer on the correct Kubota fuel filters, so of course I bought 3, now I need to hide the other 2 so I'll never ever be able to find them.



I am a happy camper, new filter made it run better but it still sputtered and died and was obviously not happy.

So I removed the hose feeding the filter from the gas tank, and drained out about 4.5 gallons of off road diesel that worked perfectly in December.

Poured in 2 gallons of fresh truckstop diesel and it started but sputtered and stopped a few times... Then I decided, hey maybe I better turn on that petcock thingy so the fuel will flow to the rest of the tractor.

Runs fine.. sitting at 2k RPM warming up as I write this, and I can hear it in the back yard.

So thanks to all here who pointed me in this direction and agreed that fuel starvation was the likely problem.

I searched and searched in the factory service module for any method to "bleed the injectors" and for this model B2100 there does not appear to be any procedure in the manual.. just what I will attach for the second time that you are supposed to do when you change the fuel filter.

So.. now back to pushing the topsoil around the garden.

Happy Thanks to all, hopefully this thread will help some other poor soul who decided to cheap out on fuel. No more off road for me.

Well.. After 15-20 minutes of pushing dirt around, it is back to it's bad behavior. Sputtering, and won't run.
I did notice that the fuel filter was not full, when it started sputtering, and after 10-20 seconds fuel slowly filled the filter.. so perhaps there is crap in the tank that is moving around and blocking fuel exiting the tank.
It sure poured out fast when I drained it though..
Will keep investigating, and report back, but as of now it will not start.

Guess I can order the inexpensive fuel lift pump, and throw one of those at it, as I am fully convinced that fuel delivery is the issue.

Wish me luck.

CPU

 

[GreensvilleJay]

I'm happy, you're happy and 'up and running' !

 

[tthorkil]

The only difference between the on-road and off-road diesel fuel is the red dye and lower price for the off-road because of no tax. The one possibility for poorer quality off-road diesel is if the station does not sell very much off-road diesel and there gets condensation in the tank(s) therefore gets water in the fuel - diesel fuel seems to not degrade much over time.

 

[Donystoy]

The only difference between the on-road and off-road diesel fuel is the red dye. The one possibility for poorer quality off-road diesel is if the station does not sell very much off-road diesel and there gets condensation in the tank(s) therefore gets water in the fuel - diesel fuel seems to not degrade much over time.

I have used colored off road diesel almost exclusively for over 35 years without issues. The only additive I have ever used is the occasional diesel injector cleaner. Engine has always started and run like a champ for over 2000 hours.

 

[je1279]

Based on your update, you either have something in the fuel system that's blocking flow on occasion or a failing pump.

 

[D2Cat]

Off road diesel is not the problem. The place you purchased the fuel is not doing something correctly, so just purchase the off road at a truck stop that has a high volume of sales. Those truckers will not stand for fuel problems and the station selling to them knows that. Buy your fuel there and don't pay the road tax for tractor use.

As others have said, been using off road for years and it's not a problem, just know where you are buying it!

 

[NHSleddog]

You mean extra taxes paid don't make the fuel magically better?

And AFAIC, 2.50+ for off road isn't cheap fuel - lol.

Off road is the same and SHOULD be used on all machines not using the roads. Unless you are one of those that likes paying extra taxes. If so, I have to ask, do you also send in extra cash with your W2 and skip all the pesky deductions?