Kubota g1900s hst

Mc1856

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Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
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Hi, new to this forum, so not really sure if I’ve posted this correctly. I have a old Kubota g1900s hst. It's always run fine, but cut out & then jump started (I was distracted & touched leads wrong way... Never tried start) when done correctly engine cranked & started then cut out, I checked fuel pump & wasn't working. (Not sure if it was before)

I ordered new pump & all was fine started engine & it rev'd well.. then smoke came out alternator & started running poorly, fuses haven't blown below steering wheel, dash lights up still gauges move, but can't hear fuel pump now, but hear clicking when key turned (haven't attempted to start it again)

had read battery cell may of been damaged & caused alternator to over work & burn out.

any help/advice would be appreciated. Than
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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Williamstown Ontario Canada
From the parts illustrations on line your machine has a dynamo not an alternator. Dynamo's are almost bullet proof and it is had to think what you could do do damage one.

The dynamo consists of a series of permanent magnets which rotate around a stationary stator coil. The magnets are attached to the flywheel (inside the dynamo) which is rotated via the engine cooling fan drive belt. The resultant output is an alternating current. The alternating current is converted to direct current by the regulator/rectifier which limits output and sends direct current to the battery

forum G1900 dynamo.jpg


To test the dynamo you need to break its two output leads and, while the engine is running at high rpm's measure the AC voltage between the two leads. Should be at least 24 volts.

Forum member Lugbolt has provided this useful test procedure:

the regulator/rectifier has 6 wires. 2 are the same color, they end up at the dynamo. AC. One is a black ground wire. You will also have a +12v from the slow-blow fuse, and a +12v ignition (key on) and then a wire that runs to a charge lamp (if applicable, but it'll still have that wire).

Typically loss of charging performance is fairly easy to diagnose if you have the know-how, and a digital volt-ohm meter that has any quality whatsoever. A $10 one isn't that, just something else to throw into file 13 when it reads wrong.

The two dynamo wires (usually sky blue) are AC voltage, as said. Start engine, disconnect regulator and test ac output at the regulator connector, between the two dynamo wires. Should be 24V+ and I like to see more than 45 or so at full throttle. If it charges anything it's probably ok, they are a foolproof and extremely simple design that rarely fails outside of seized bearings. OK? Move on. Check your ground at the reg connector. One probe of the DVOM (set to ohms) on the ground pin in the connector and the other pin on a good ground, frame, transmission, etc. Must be clean. If you have more than a few ohms of resistance, your ground or harness is suspect

onward. Find your wire that comes from the battery. Backprobe the regulator connector. Now put your DVOM on DC volts. One probe goes to your connector, the other goes to the battery +. Should be under 500mv, or 0.500v. Ok? Move on. More than 0.5v? You have either a harness problem or a bad connection at the fuse, or whatever.

Last wire that will affect charging is what I call the "trigger" wire...it turns the reguator "on" so to speak, via the key switch. That one gets 12v when the key is on. Same as the last test, backprobe the connector with the key on. One probe of the DVOM in the connector and the other to the + battery terminal (use the post not the cable). You want to see less than 0.5v on the meter. If you see more than that, harness, fuse block, keyswitch, etc. Follow your wiring diagram. If you do see less than 0.5v, that circuit is not suspect, and there's a possibity you have a bad regulator.

Ideally you want to test everything AROUND the regulator because testing the reg itself isn't always conclusive. Thus, once you know you have AC voltage from the dynamo, you have good ground, you have +12v from the batt and ignition switch, the only component left is the reg. Process of elimination.

Electrical diag is not all that hard or it can be. It's all what you make of it. Don't put too much thought into it because it'll bite you. It's simple for the most part

speaking of being bit, be careful around the dynamo wires when testing. There's a little bit of voltage there and it's ac voltage, so it can bite you.


Start by removing your battery and have it tested. Replace if in weak condition.
If the battery cables have repair ends at the battery, buy new cables. Clean where negative battery cable attaches to tractor frame.

forum battery repair.jpg



If you had smoke coming from your machine and had reversed jumper cables, it is likely the regulator/rectifier is burned out.

There are test procedures for the regulator/rectifier but you need a good multi meter and the skill to use it.

There is a fusible link located near the starter which is the main fuse for the complete machine.

forum G1900 fusible.jpg


Dave
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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The owner switched to having a conversation with me rather than continuing to post where all could see.

I have taken the liberty of moving his tale back to the forum


Thanks for info Dave.
It does have alternator as per attached. Although I’m no mechanical expert.

forum G1900 alternator.jpg


it cranks over now & think it would start, but seems like new fuel pump isn’t working again.

It’s always fired & ran & did yesterday until alternator smoked... ran rough (think due to fuel pump stopping at same time for some reason & lack fuel)

I did look for voltage regulator under wheel &couldn’t see it. (I think it meant to be by 4 fuses)

something caused fuel pump to stop yesterday at same time alternator smoked. I’m guessing if it gets fuel it will fire again... but don’t want put another pump on for it to break it again. Would another battery help? Incase old one damaged
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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Your alternator has a built in regulator so there is no external one.

Take your alternator and battery to have them tested. With smoke coming out of the alternator at one point it is likely something inside is damaged. A poor battery is just going to frustrate you and possibly damage a repaired/replaced alternator as it struggles to deal with a weak battery.

Are you following this procedure to bleed the fuel injection system Doing this will tell you if your fuel pump is working.

forum G1900 bleeding.jpg


Are you following the starting instructions including the pre-heating of the glow plug?

forum G1900 glow plug.jpg


Dave
 

Mc1856

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Equipment
Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
16
0
1
England
Your alternator has a built in regulator so there is no external one.

Take your alternator and battery to have them tested. With smoke coming out of the alternator at one point it is likely something inside is damaged. A poor battery is just going to frustrate you and possibly damage a repaired/replaced alternator as it struggles to deal with a weak battery.

Are you following this procedure to bleed the fuel injection system Doing this will tell you if your fuel pump is working.

View attachment 54229

Are you following the starting instructions including the pre-heating of the glow plug?

View attachment 54230

Dave
thanks for information. Yes I know how to bleed it & new pump I got was working until the alternator smoked & then it ran rough as fuel pump had stopped. Will get alternator checked, I know battery isn’t holding charge enough to fire it. So will get new battery. But I’m concerned if I replace fuel pump again as somehow that’s been damaged & new battery that something will damage them again & alternator.
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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Williamstown Ontario Canada
thanks for information. Yes I know how to bleed it & new pump I got was working until the alternator smoked & then it ran rough as fuel pump had stopped. Will get alternator checked, I know battery isn’t holding charge enough to fire it. So will get new battery. But I’m concerned if I replace fuel pump again as somehow that’s been damaged & new battery that something will damage them again & alternator.
Do I recall correctly that you had tried to boost the machine but had the booster cables reversed?

If this happened, damage to electronic and electrical components is to be expected. Included in the probable list of damaged stuff would be the alternator and possibly the fuel pump.

Companies like John Deere on newer vintage machines recognize the damage reversed booster or charger cables can cause and incorporate safety relays and diodes within the wiring harness to prevent such damage. Kubota does not do this.

Dave
 

Mc1856

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Equipment
Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
16
0
1
England
Do I recall correctly that you had tried to boost the machine but had the booster cables reversed?

If this happened, damage to electronic and electrical components is to be expected. Included in the probable list of damaged stuff would be the alternator and possibly the fuel pump.

Companies like John Deere on newer vintage machines recognize the damage reversed booster or charger cables can cause and incorporate safety relays and diodes within the wiring harness to prevent such damage. Kubota does not do this.

Dave
Yes I touched them wrong way for a second/spark. Then I tested fuel pump as no fuel... I ordered a new fuel pump replaced it & it worked & fried machine, run fine & then after minute or so the alternator smoked & new fuel pump not working. I am fairly certain it will fire again with another pump on it, but don’t want to put another on for the same to happen.
 

Todd C

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I would start by getting the alternator checked (and probably replaced). It might be possible your internal regulator is shorted to the point of drawing down the battery such that the fuel pump isn't getting the juice to do it's job.
 

Mc1856

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Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
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England
I would start by getting the alternator checked (and probably replaced). It might be possible your internal regulator is shorted to the point of drawing down the battery such that the fuel pump isn't getting the juice to do it's job.
Thanks. Could the alternator smoking have damaged fuel pump? I will disconnect alternator & see if fuel pump works when turn key first point. To see if need get another new one. Would a damaged battery / cell of caused alternator to burn out?
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
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Yes I touched them wrong way for a second/spark. Then I tested fuel pump as no fuel... I ordered a new fuel pump replaced it & it worked & fried machine, run fine & then after minute or so the alternator smoked & new fuel pump not working. I am fairly certain it will fire again with another pump on it, but don’t want to put another on for the same to happen.
Electronics such as in an alternator can be fried in milliseconds. There is no second chance.

Do you have a multi meter and know how to measure ohms?

Dave
 

Mc1856

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Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
16
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England
Electronics such as in an alternator can be fried in milliseconds. There is no second chance.

Do you have a multi meter and know how to measure ohms?

Dave
I have alternator/battery tester. Or did have as was testing alternator was charging battery when it started smoking & has also damaged tester as doesn’t light up now.... but of a disaster really!
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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Williamstown Ontario Canada
I have alternator/battery tester. Or did have as was testing alternator was charging battery when it started smoking & has also damaged tester as doesn’t light up now.... but of a disaster really!
I suggest you invest in a 12 volt test light to help you get your machine going. Available any auto parts store for $10 to $15.

With the test light you can easily check if power is getting to the fuel pump before deciding the pump needs to be replaced.

Test light.jpg


If power is reaching the fuel pump but it is not working then you need to replace it

I do not know where you bought the fuel pump but in your circumstance, I would consider buying one from Amazon for $22 until everything is working again and then you can consider buying a genuine Kubota fuel pump to enjoy the long life a genuine part can provide.

Amazon

Dave
 

Mc1856

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Equipment
Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
16
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1
England
I suggest you invest in a 12 volt test light to help you get your machine going. Available any auto parts store for $10 to $15.

With the test light you can easily check if power is getting to the fuel pump before deciding the pump needs to be replaced.

View attachment 54255

If power is reaching the fuel pump but it is not working then you need to replace it

I do not know where you bought the fuel pump but in your circumstance, I would consider buying one from Amazon for $22 until everything is working again and then you can consider buying a genuine Kubota fuel pump to enjoy the long life a genuine part can provide.

Amazon

Dave
yes i will get another tester & see if fuel pump is getting power. Think when alternator smoked it damaged the new fuel pump I had got.. was cheap Ish amazon One luckily.

im fairly certain it will fire again when gets fuel... just don’t want to put new pump, alternator & battery on for then to be damaged again if a underlying fault is still there.

Thanks for all your help.
Ian
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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Williamstown Ontario Canada
yes i will get another tester & see if fuel pump is getting power. Think when alternator smoked it damaged the new fuel pump I had got.. was cheap Ish amazon One luckily.

im fairly certain it will fire again when gets fuel... just don’t want to put new pump, alternator & battery on for then to be damaged again if a underlying fault is still there.

Thanks for all your help.
Ian
The only fault I can imagine is the backwards cable connection. You could connecct the fuel pump directly to the battery thus bypassing the wiring harness to be certain no other funny thing is going on.

Only replace the battery if it tests bad otherwise, it may have been weak because of not being charged adequately by the alternator.

The diodes in the alternator are like a one way check valve. If these get damaged there is nothing to prevent the battery from discharging to ground through the alternator turning the alternator into a toaster,

Dave
 

Mc1856

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Equipment
Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
16
0
1
England
The only fault I can imagine is the backwards cable connection. You could connecct the fuel pump directly to the battery thus bypassing the wiring harness to be certain no other funny thing is going on.

Only replace the battery if it tests bad otherwise, it may have been weak because of not being charged adequately by the alternator.

The diodes in the alternator are like a one way check valve. If these get damaged there is nothing to prevent the battery from discharging to ground through the alternator turning the alternator into a toaster,

Dave
Ok. The battery is no good now. But hasn’t damaged alternator in past few yrs... but if connecting wrong jump lead damaged cell on battery & then possibly caused alternator to over work & burn out maybe... but would that then break fuel pump. Will replace all 3 & hope that sorts it as is very good machine/ engine for age.
 

Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
5,235
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Williamstown Ontario Canada
Ok. The battery is no good now. But hasn’t damaged alternator in past few yrs... but if connecting wrong jump lead damaged cell on battery & then possibly caused alternator to over work & burn out maybe... but would that then break fuel pump. Will replace all 3 & hope that sorts it as is very good machine/ engine for age.
The battery is the strongest item on the machine to tolerate a momentary reversed lead situation.

Reversing the battery jump leads momentarily damaged the alternator and likely the fuel pump.

Dave
 

Mc1856

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Equipment
Kubota g1900s hst
Jan 31, 2021
16
0
1
England
Hopefully get it sorted once change alternator & get another fuel pump. Alternator failing must’ve broke the new fuel pump too. Thanks for your help & advice.