Excavation Cost shocker

[johnjk]

Looking at having a pond put in , nothing big, around .5 acre and 10' deep. I am in a clay area so doing it with my B3200 is not an option. The area it will go in to is drive up accessible, no trees to remove, just start digging. Got my first quote back and the guy wants 30K to do the job. 15K to dig the pond and another 15K to spread the dirt to two areas, one being right behind the pond and the other over where I want my barn pad to be which is about 1500 feet from the pond. For those of you who do this work or have had it done, is this out of line? I understand the cost of equipment and bodies to run it, but they are saying 2 days to complete with 2 people on the job. I'm getting other quotes from other excavation companies to get a better feel for it. There's always the option of renting an excavator for a couple weeks and doing the work myself as well.

 

[Jriedy85]

It may be a little on the high side but not completely out of the ball park. Since you are moving the dirt and spreading it around that is going to add some cost to the job. If you were just digging a half acre pond and using the dirt to build the banks up or storing it right near the pond in a mound I would expect that to cost around 15 to 20 thousand. I'm not an excavator but I am a professional land surveyor and I do a lot of pond design and layout.

 

[ken erickson]

Last summer I had a local excavating company that also does some pond work give me a estimate for a much smaller pond on my land. Roughly 75 foot long and 35 foot wide. My soil is loamy sand. The estimate was 13k with either trucked in clay liner or synthetic liner, my choice. The excavated material would have been used to build up banks or spread in close proximity .
Good luck with your pond project!

 

[johnjk]

Thanks guys. It helps to have a reality check. I can source clean fill from one of the construction projects near by and leave the pond go and save up more for it. At this point I'd rather not cut in to the barn fund and delay that project.

 

[Daren Todd]

Thanks guys. It helps to have a reality check. I can source clean fill from one of the construction projects near by and leave the pond go and save up more for it. At this point I'd rather not cut in to the barn fund and delay that project.

How far to the two areas that need the material? That in my opinion would be the main cost.

I've seen a few ponds that size built in a day with a D6 dozer. No digging involved. If it was just the pond, the most economical way to accomplish it would be to rent a dozer for a weekend and have at it.

Are the two areas that need material within pushing distance?

 

[ccoon520]

How far to the two areas that need the material? That in my opinion would be the main cost.

I've seen a few ponds that size built in a day with a D6 dozer. No digging involved. If it was just the pond, the most economical way to accomplish it would be to rent a dozer for a weekend and have at it.

Are the two areas that need material within pushing distance?

If they are outside pushing distance maybe make a pile and move a few bucket loads a day with the loader. It'll take forever and would get more difficult the longer the pile is there but at least it only costs time, maintenance, and fuel at that point.

 

[Daren Todd]

If they are outside pushing distance maybe make a pile and move a few bucket loads a day with the loader. It'll take forever and would get more difficult the longer the pile is there but at least it only costs time, maintenance, and fuel at that point.

I'm a cheap bast**d. I'm with yeah on that option.

 

[ken erickson]

13k not being a option at the time I waited till I had the L2501 and dug a small wildlife pond in my 100 yard rifle range area. I used some of the excavated soil to build up my backstop berm. Even though I have not trucked in clay yet for a liner I have enough standing water for a while that I am already attracting wildlife. Digging this small pond has given me the confidence to dig another next spring on the far side of my land.

 

[johnjk]

How far to the two areas that need the material? That in my opinion would be the main cost.

I've seen a few ponds that size built in a day with a D6 dozer. No digging involved. If it was just the pond, the most economical way to accomplish it would be to rent a dozer for a weekend and have at it.

Are the two areas that need material within pushing distance?

Within 1000 feet of each other just down the drainage channel, however this channel crosses over the pipe that feeds my leach bed so I don't want to be going over it with a dozer. The round about way is probably 2000 ft and too far to just push it there.

 

[johnjk]

13k not being a option at the time I waited till I had the L2501 and dug a small wildlife pond in my 100 yard rifle range area. I used some of the excavated soil to build up my backstop berm. Even though I have not trucked in clay yet for a liner I have enough standing water for a while that I am already attracting wildlife. Digging this small pond has given me the confidence to dig another next spring on the far side of my land. View attachment 48731 View attachment 48732 View attachment 48733

Looks nice. All I have is clay as far as you can dig. It is in three states depending on the time of year. Frozen solid, too wet and heavy to get a good bite with my small tractor and too dry to get in more than an inch or two at a time.

 

[SidecarFlip]

One thing to keep in mind and that is, if you reside in a zoned community (have no idea where you live), a zoned community or zoned township will have ordinances pertaining to pond construction as well as engineering of it.

More to digging a pond that just digging a hole and allowing it to fill with water and then there is the upkeep after the fact. Stagnant bodies of water (ponds) can become nasty mosquito havens with algae and a general mess and it you have neighbors, you could have drainage issues.

Around here, a pond excavation begins with the zoning board approval with engineered drawings and how a pond impacts local drainage and then where / what the spoil will be used for and finally, if approved, a surety bond from a certified contractor as to the timely completion of the project.

How it plays here. You don't just dig a hole anywhere in the 'zoned' township.

I ought to know, my wife is head of the Planning Board. I'd say 50% of applications are denied.

 

[Magicman]

too dry to get in more than an inch or two at a time.

It is amazing what a ~$100 single tooth sub soiler can/will do to loosen the soil so that you can scoop it up.

 

[johnjk]

One thing to keep in mind and that is, if you reside in a zoned community (have no idea where you live), a zoned community or zoned township will have ordinances pertaining to pond construction as well as engineering of it.

More to digging a pond that just digging a hole and allowing it to fill with water and then there is the upkeep after the fact. Stagnant bodies of water (ponds) can become nasty mosquito havens with algae and a general mess and it you have neighbors, you could have drainage issues.

Around here, a pond excavation begins with the zoning board approval with engineered drawings and how a pond impacts local drainage and then where / what the spoil will be used for and finally, if approved, a surety bond from a certified contractor as to the timely completion of the project.

How it plays here. You don't just dig a hole anywhere in the 'zoned' township.

I ought to know, my wife is head of the Planning Board. I'd say 50% of applications are denied.

I am way out in the country. No zoning, HOA or other pesky entity to deal with. I did contact the township and was told that since I am a farm there are no permits or other requirements needed. The only rule is to be 10' from any property lines and 60' from any septic systems. I did however get ahold of my soil and conservation district. They offer a free pond design/review and will go over your location, size, inflow/outflow and let you know if the location you are looking at is gonna have issues down the road. The last thing I want is to have the outflow go up against the foundation of the house and cause headaches.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I own a working farm (what I do) and live in the 'middle of nowhere' as well but my middle of nowhere is also in a zoned township.. Just got done round bailing btw.

 

[Magicman]

Remember that the back side of nowhere is the front side of somewhere else.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

'fun' with numbers....
1/2 acre= 21,780 square feet
10 feet deep... 217,800 cufeet
about 8,000 cubic yards
so.. 24,000 buckets, if 1/3 yard capacity
so..... more than a days job.....

the subsoiler 'trick' works very well BTW, BTDT for 'swales'.....
How it gets done depends on where and how that material can be relocated. Also time for the job... It's common up here for a contractor to leave heavy equipment at the last job, until the next job. say he has a 2 week 'lull'. Cut a deal to do your job 'inbetween' his real jobs...

 

[ccoon520]

'fun' with numbers....
1/2 acre= 21,780 square feet
10 feet deep... 217,800 cufeet
about 8,000 cubic yards
so.. 24,000 buckets, if 1/3 yard capacity
so..... more than a days job.....

the subsoiler 'trick' works very well BTW, BTDT for 'swales'.....
How it gets done depends on where and how that material can be relocated. Also time for the job... It's common up here for a contractor to leave heavy equipment at the last job, until the next job. say he has a 2 week 'lull'. Cut a deal to do your job 'inbetween' his real jobs...

That's right but remember you can't take a square chunk of soil out because the walls will cave in.

More Fun with Numbers:

So the maximum angle is 63° for type A soil (I think clay is type A but in any case it is the steepest walls.

Which creates a triangle with an area of 98 sqft or 98 cubic feet for every foot of circumferance/perimiter. Now assuming the pond is a circle like ponds tend to be (ish?) and since it has the most efficient area to perimeter I'll be using that:

A half acre circles diameter being 117.75' and the circumferance being 739.7' the area that is left behind is 72,500 cubic feet or so.

Making the area that has to be left behind to prevent collapse being about 2600 cubic yards.

So it is probably around 5400 cubic feet or 16,200 buckets.

if OP wanted the steepest slope possible at all points and the pond to be 10' deep everywhere possible.



Don't get me wrong that is a lot of dirt but if OP also got a bobcat to move the dirt which a 72" skid steer has about a .5cubic yard capacity or 10000 buckets or they could rent a wheel loader for about the cost of the dozer (I assume) and a compact one can move 2-2.5 cubic yards a load. Which would probably get it done in a couple weekends (one weekend for each piece of equipment rented) for 5-10 grand depending on the cost to rent the dozer and the wheel loader and how much time they have.

mostly I did the math because your numbers intrigued me and I was interested in what realistic numbers could look like.

 

[ccoon520]

Within 1000 feet of each other just down the drainage channel, however this channel crosses over the pipe that feeds my leach bed so I don't want to be going over it with a dozer. The round about way is probably 2000 ft and too far to just push it there.

I don't know for sure but maybe look at the types of dozers you can rent and see what their weight and track sizes are. depending on the size of track the actual weight that the pipe would see could be comparable to a full sized truck due to the track dispersing the weight across a larger area. Just a thought.

 

[Tornado]

I have 13 acres and have often dreamed of having a pond on it somewhere, but never put any serious thought into making it happen. I've watched videos of folks digging ponds with small tractors using just the loader but I often watched those videos and thought to myself that it looked like it would be hard on the machine, just the constant force on the loader over and over and over. It would take hundreds if not thousands of digs. Thtats largely why I never seriously considered even trying. Id love to hear from some who maybe dug a small pond with a little tractor similar to my L2501. My worry is just that it would age the tractor substantially doing that kind of work, and while I know tractors are made to work, I really dont want to kill my tractor trying to dig a pond.

 

[ccoon520]

I have 13 acres and have often dreamed of having a pond on it somewhere, but never put any serious thought into making it happen. I've watched videos of folks digging ponds with small tractors using just the loader but I often watched those videos and thought to myself that it looked like it would be hard on the machine, just the constant force on the loader over and over and over. It would take hundreds if not thousands of digs. Thtats largely why I never seriously considered even trying. Id love to hear from some who maybe dug a small pond with a little tractor similar to my L2501. My worry is just that it would age the tractor substantially doing that kind of work, and while I know tractors are made to work, I really dont want to kill my tractor trying to dig a pond.

You probably wouldn't advance the wear of the tractor all that much. In essence a tractor is a hydraulic pump attached to wheels with different outputs. Basically that pump is producing x and sending it to output A, B, C, D or some combination of that and it will continue to do so as long as power and working fluid is available to it.

Implements (especially ground engaging ones) have outside factors to deal with like rocks and roots, differing soil types (in some instances), that body you forgot you hid, etc. So what you could see excessive wear on is your loader and since your loader is attached to the strongest part of the tractor and its frame does not move (usually) the moving parts would see the wear and strain as long as you don't try and push the loader beyond its limits. So it'd be no different than putting 1000 hours on it brush cutting or any other demanding task. However the implement that is doing the work will see that wear.

As long as the mobile hydraulic pump (and it's motor) isn't getting stalled, cavitated, or overheated and is maintained it should see the same relative life cycle (hours wise) whether it is plowing soil or digging with the loader.