CVT vs. Automatic Transmission in car

Tornado

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OK folks. I figured this would be a good place to plop a question Im researching. I know there are a lot of mechanical minds here on this forum and folks who have owned lots of vehicles and have have some good experience that I would like to draw from.

My wife is due for a new vehicle. She has been looking and researching SUV's for weeks now finding what she wants. She has narrowed it down, with my input along the way, to a Toyota Rav4. My wife has never owned a car that she got to pick for herself - it was hand me downs from her parents and the like, and the current car she has was also given to her by her parents. She has always driven a bare bones little corolla. She has put herself through nursing school, graduated top of her class, worked hard, and in the 9 years of being with her I have watched her go from a low point in life when we first met, to running a medical facility as a competent nurse administrator. I'm so proud of how far she has come. I say all that to say that I want my wife to finally have the car she wants. Her income has of course drastically increased in the last many years, so she can afford what she wants. She hit a dog months ago in the current car, after being called in to work in the middle of the night, and busted the front plastics of her car all up, even pushed the radiator back (no leaks). I had to cut portions of the plastics away with a reciprocating saw, as it was all hanging and dragging in the road nearly. At 200,000 miles and with the damage, the car looks ragged at this point. Toyota obviously wants a lot of money to fix it all, but we have no interest in dumping that into this car. Its time for the new vehicle to happen. We are going this weekend to visit the lots - may even make a deal who knows. She is relying on me with regards to the engine, transmission, etc, as she knows nothing about those things. So, I've been researching the options of the Toyota Rav4.

I am familiar with the various transmissions and how they work, but not in which is better or if one has a lot of more problems compared to the other. I have never driven a vehicle wit ha CVT transmission. There is a lot of positive online about them, and a lot of negative, depending on who you talk to it seems. I like many aspects of the CVT on paper. I think my wife would like the CVT in terms of drivability. What Im trying to avoid of course is buying into a transmission that maybe has lots of problems and then we end up regretting it down the road. I would love any input or opinions or experience on this front. We are looking at some loaded rav4's with all the bells and whistles. Often I have the option between an 8speed automatic trans or the CVT. Im also looking at regular rav4 vs. hybrid rav4. Most ofthe fancy rav4's seem to all be hybrids. They say people fear what they dont understand - and I have always looked at hybrids and such with a little bit of a dirty look. Now that I am actually researching them though I find a lot of great stuff about these rav4 hybrids. They are faster, snappier, better acceleration, and much better gas millage. I am not a mechanic however, nor have I had lots of experience with lots of vehicles. My last truck was a 98 tacoma and I drove it from 18 years old to 35 years old when I bought my most recent Ford F-150. So, any and any feedback, opinions, and insights welcome.
 

SidecarFlip

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I prefer a stick shift myself.... How is that...lol

Never been a fan of any automatic, CVT or conventional torque converter wet clutched box including a Kubota hydrostat. Too inefficient for me.

Having said that however, push comes to shove, I'll take a CVT over a conventional slush box torque converter transmission because the CVT is more efficient so long as the variable speed sheaves and 'belt' are made of durable materials.

Many new high powered ag tractors today are some type of CVT transmission
 

dochsml

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The wife and I bought a Subaru Forester 3 years ago and it has a CVT. It takes a little getting used to, but we love it. You get used to a regular automatic and how it shifts by modulating the accelerator. The CVT is a little different as it doesn't really have gears. Ours will stutter a bit if we let off the gas to try and get it to 'upshift'. Just keep pressing the pedal and it will be smooth. The Subaru also has a manual stick shift mode where it emulates 8 gears within the CVT. I don't really use that, but would probably be fun for me 20 years ago.
 

sparky45

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All you really need to do is visit a transmission shop and ask about repair costs over a conventional auto transmission.:eek:
 
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Tornado

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All you really need to do is visit a transmission shop and ask about repair costs over a conventional auto transmission.:eek:
You hit on one of the negatives of the CVT here , and one of my concerns and why I made this thread. I want to try and find out how reliable these CVT's are. Im sure it will likely also matter which manufacturer is behind the cvt - perhaps some are better engineered than others.

I do know one thing - the Rav4 is the number 1 selling SUV in the United States, and a very big chunk of them are CVT transmissions. Im trying to dig around and see how reliable they are - as I would expect a lot of folks to have some experience with them. Neither me or my wife have ever even ridden in a vehicle wit ha cvt transmission, much less driven one, so its a big unkown to us. Many of the Rav4's she keeps picking out however are a CVT transmission.
 

Tornado

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The wife and I bought a Subaru Forester 3 years ago and it has a CVT. It takes a little getting used to, but we love it. You get used to a regular automatic and how it shifts by modulating the accelerator. The CVT is a little different as it doesn't really have gears. Ours will stutter a bit if we let off the gas to try and get it to 'upshift'. Just keep pressing the pedal and it will be smooth. The Subaru also has a manual stick shift mode where it emulates 8 gears within the CVT. I don't really use that, but would probably be fun for me 20 years ago.
appreciate that input dochsml. 3 years with no issues is good to hear. My wife looked at subaru as well but for whatever reason passed them by. She has spent weeks watching YouTube videos and looking online at all the various SUV's.

I am familiar with how the CVT works, and of the fact that it will take some getting used to it. I'm mostly concerned with reliability of these things, or if they have any quirks that make them annoying to drive. You mention a stutter for example when you let off the gas - those are things Id like to be aware of.
 

hagrid

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Nissan did a pretty good job proving CVT automotive applications are lacking refinement.
 
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bcp

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Get the car she wants.

When the warranty runs out, trade it in on a new one she wants.

Quit worrying about it.

Bruce
 
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sparky45

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Nissan did a pretty good job proving CVT automotive applications are lacking refinement.
Had a Nissan Murano with all the bells and whistles; had to go in for a failing brake system and the owner of the Transmission shop (a personal friend) advised me to get rid of the Murano before any transmission issues developed. Said it's not a matter of if it's going to need repair, but when. Suggested I buy something WITHOUT a CVT system.
 

i7win7

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Goto local library, Consumer Reports should have an issue on suv's - even if it's last years models.
 

dirtydeed

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I don't know if Toyota manufactures their own CVT's, I've always heard that the Jatco CVT's (used in nissan) were pure junk.
 
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Tornado

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Thanks for all the replies guys.

I just wanted to add a few things here. Ive been researching cvt's a lot last couple days. I can say that it does seem to depend tremendously on the manufacturer of the cvt. Some brands seem to get a lot of bad reviews, while others seem to get really good reviews. The eCVT in the Toyota Rav4's seems to be one of the ones I've read a lot of positive reviews on. I have read some comments from folks who got one of these transmissions in a rav4 for example and then proclaimed that they ended up loving it so much they would never go back to a standard automatic transmission. It seems like with everything though, the opinions on them are as varied as can be. Im trying to sift through opinion to find important data that concerns me, such as reliability and performance.
 

D2Cat

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I know a 25 yr. old that does not know a screwdriver from a pliers and has a Rav4. He purchased it used in the Fall of the year. I think it is a 2013 model, but not sure. The next summer in July he complains that after he drives a 100 miles it won't "go any faster", he can't pick up speed at all. But he kept on driving it, the best he could because he was between Kansas City and Columbia, Mo and had to get to that party!!

After some homework, discover the transmission (CVT) gets hot and goes into limp mode. As soon as the sensor says the temperature is OK, it runs fine, so the problem never occured in cool weather. That model had an aftermarket transmission cooler required to keep it from going into the limp mode.

Might see how they handle that situation now.
 
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Tornado

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I know a 25 yr. old that does not know a screwdriver from a pliers and has a Rav4. He purchased it used in the Fall of the year. I think it is a 2013 model, but not sure. The next summer in July he complains that after he drives a 100 miles it won't "go any faster", he can't pick up speed at all. But he kept on driving it, the best he could because he was between Kansas City and Columbia, Mo and had to get to that party!!

After some homework, discover the transmission (CVT) gets hot and goes into limp mode. As soon as the sensor says the temperature is OK, it runs fine, so the problem never occured in cool weather. That model had an aftermarket transmission cooler required to keep it from going into the limp mode.

Might see how they handle that situation now.
Hey D2cat, yea problems with heat is an issue I've come across in my reading. I have not seen as much of that in newer models however. The first year that toyota put cvt's in cars I think was 2014. Im not sure if they put them in the rav 4 that year though, but either way, it would suggest the guy in ur story there may have had one of the very first cvt rav4's introduced. From what I can tell - it does seem cvt's have improved over the last several years, but its hard to gauge.
 

BruceP

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As a Driver - I prefer manual xMission.

As an Engineer - I know a CVT is as close to a 'perfect' xMission humans have invented. Properly designed, it can PERFECTLY match engine to roadspeed based on conditions. (throttle setting, load, engine-torque...etc) A CVT is also DEAD SIMPLE design with very few moving parts.

A CVT is the only xMission that can deliver BETTER MPG than a well-driven manial.

Given that I have been riding snowmobiles for 40+ years, the idea of a CVT is not new to me. Snowmobiles have used CVT for over 50 years.

I own 2 CVT equiped Subaru and they have been very reliable. Subaru designes and manufactiures THEIR OWN CVTs unlike Nissan who has had troubles with their 'off the shelf built' CVT units.

It takes time to get accustomed to driving a CVT vehicle to take advantage of its capabilities. From a stop, apply VERY light throttle and allow the CVT to do its magic. It still amazes me that I can keep the engine RPMs under 1000 and watch the roadspeed climb up to the 40MPH SMMOOTTHHLLYY with no shifting.

It has been my experience that folks who do not like CVTs do not take the time to understand how it works and how to use it.

Some companies, instead of going the CVT route, have been adding more and more gears to their automatic xMissions in an effort to approxamate a CVT. In my engineering mind, this is just more moving parts to fail.
 
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UpNorthMI

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I see a few mentions in the above postings of Subaru. Some years ago we spent an extended winter trip in Vermont and quickly realized that there was a very high number of Subaru vehicles on the roads there, including our friends there had 2. The reason was the severe winters, lots of hills, deep snow and ice. My wife had several 4 wheel drive small SUV models prior to this and we were about to change her vehicle, we decided to buy a Subaru Outback. We are now on our 3rd Subaru, my son has one too. They all had CVT and have probably been the best vehicles we have owned in terms of 4 wheel drive capability, safety, reliability, gas mileage and resale value.

Here in MI the Subaru CVT / 4 wheel drive combination does really well in the bad winter weather, other than ground clearance the Subaru outperforms my GMC 3500, Cadillac, and Mercedes, all of which are either all wheel or 4 wheel drive. I guess those people in Vermont had already figured this out many years ago.

Your OP title was CVT v's Automatic, I just think as CVT just being another type of automatic, my wife (and I'm guessing 50% of CVT drivers) would tell you her Subaru is automatic, she has no idea what a CVT is. A few google searches are likely to alert you to a specific vehicle model potential issues, the other issue is how you drive them and care for them. I'm certainly happy to buy a Subaru with a CVT gearbox.
 

dochsml

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appreciate that input dochsml. 3 years with no issues is good to hear. My wife looked at subaru as well but for whatever reason passed them by. She has spent weeks watching YouTube videos and looking online at all the various SUV's.

I am familiar with how the CVT works, and of the fact that it will take some getting used to it. I'm mostly concerned with reliability of these things, or if they have any quirks that make them annoying to drive. You mention a stutter for example when you let off the gas - those are things Id like to be aware of.
I haven't had any issues to speak of, but of course I'm still on my honeymoon with it. You get used to it real quick. Mine is the turbo model. Push button sport mode is nice. Subaru uses a metal chain and claims it is completely maintenance free for the life of the powertrain. I plan on running it till the wheels fall off, so ask me again in 2030!
 

PapaJ

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We had a 2009 Nissan Cube with a CVT. Driving wise, couldn't tell any difference between it and your standard automatic transmission. What it DID teach us is that when a CVT dies, it just dies. Immediately and completely. Now, in 2009, it was fairly new technology, and Nissan even extended the transmission warranty out to 120K because of all the failures they had. Mine was at 122K when it died, and they wouldn't help me out. Personally, I'll never have another CVT transmission unless there is no other choice.
 
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old and tired

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Bought a Nissan Versa (cash for clunkers) and they extended the transmission warranty after we purchased the vehicle, thank goodness, Got a new transmission last year!!! According to the dealer the belts are larger so I should be good for another 10 years or more!!!

I love that car and transmission... we also got a heck of a deal, sticker was a hair over 17k and paid 10k for it.
 

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I would certainly recommend a Toyota Rav-4 but would get the non-hybrid that has an 8 speed automatic transmission. Have heard very little positive about CVT transmissions up here and to expect to replace it once it has reached about 150,000 kilometers.
My wife has a 2013 Toyota Camry and expects to replace it eventually with a Rav-4. Interestingly when we purchased the Camry my research found that it had more North American content than even the big three.