BX2200 breaking front driveshaft u-joint pins

[LobsterClaw207]

Hey everybody, I haven't been on in a while both because I've been real busy with a 2 year old and also I haven't had any tractor issues, so despite my enjoyment of reading here I hadn't been pressed. Love the new site design, it looks awesome!!

So my BX2200 has about 1575 hours on it. I use it with the FEL, mid mount mower, and rear mount snowblower.

In the last ~3 months or so, I've broken the spring pin that holds the u-joint to the propeller shaft for the front drive (sorry if I'm not getting the terms exact) twice.

I replaced the pin today for the second time, and paid more attention to what the tractor was doing as I mowed my yard. I felt a sort of "clunking" under my right foot near the HST pedal, which is right where the shaft is and connects to the u-joint that keeps having an issue. I'm not quite sure how to diagnose this, since I can't exactly watch it while driving and I'm also not sure how much/if any play is OK. Or if that is even the issue.

I did grease the splines on the shaft coming off the front differential going into the u-joint, in case they are binding and putting stress on that pin. The tractor is usually driving with 4WD engaged, on lawn and dirt road. There is very little pavement (my driveway, but usually I'm just crossing it, not doing a lot of turning and such on it). I'm running turf tires if it matters.

Thanks for any help! I grabbed four of the pins this time but it's a little disconcerting/annoying to have to keep replacing them and I don't want to ignore a bigger problem.

 

[Henro]

You may have not timed the u-joints properly when you reassembled after the first pin broke. Alignment IS IMPORTANT.

I lost a front u-joint due to a broken roll pin on my BX2200 with about the same number of hours on it. Apparently not uncommon.

Also, I think there is a proper orientation for the roll pin when you install it, but I am trusting my memory there (dangerous I know).

Google u-joint timing or phasing, or something similar, and you can find what you need to know.

 

[BigG]

I would check the u-joints to make sure they are still good. If you have lost the needles out of one of the cups there may be enough slop in the joint to cause it to bind up.

Why do you run in 4 x 4 most of the time? I think that would put a lot of undue stress on the drive line. I had a Massey 1528, very poorly designed and built front axle pivot and I broke the front axle off of it 3 times. It was to expensive to repair so I ran it as a 2 x 4 for years. I found I did miss the 4 x 4 but not as much as I thought I would. There were days that I needed it but I was able to do without.

 

[beex]

this issue comes up here once in a while, it’s alway the u joints are out of phase. make sure you get this right, you’ll damage the drive train.

 

[LobsterClaw207]

I would check the u-joints to make sure they are still good. If you have lost the needles out of one of the cups there may be enough slop in the joint to cause it to bind up.

Why do you run in 4 x 4 most of the time? I think that would put a lot of undue stress on the drive line. I had a Massey 1528, very poorly designed and built front axle pivot and I broke the front axle off of it 3 times. It was to expensive to repair so I ran it as a 2 x 4 for years. I found I did miss the 4 x 4 but not as much as I thought I would. There were days that I needed it but I was able to do without.

Thanks everybody for the replies, I absolutely did not know they had to be aligned I just spin the shaft until I could slide the u-joint on and line up the pin-hole, then pounded the pin in.

I run in 4x4 most of the time because with the turf tires and my terrain, they slip pretty much all the time. I can't really go to ag tires because I'll probably destroy my lawn, but even on small hills with dry grass I'll get a rear tire spinning if I'm not in 4x4.

Also, I don't know if this is supposed to happen but going downhill if I'm in 2wd the tractor basically just free-rolls down the hill much faster than I feel that it should. If I'm in 4x4 it feels like it's engine braking itself (or something similar) and will just creep down the hill as fast as I want it to with the pedal.

 

[Henro]

Thanks everybody for the replies, I absolutely did not know they had to be aligned I just spin the shaft until I could slide the u-joint on and line up the pin-hole, then pounded the pin in.

I run in 4x4 most of the time because with the turf tires and my terrain, they slip pretty much all the time. I can't really go to ag tires because I'll probably destroy my lawn, but even on small hills with dry grass I'll get a rear tire spinning if I'm not in 4x4.

Also, I don't know if this is supposed to happen but going downhill if I'm in 2wd the tractor basically just free-rolls down the hill much faster than I feel that it should. If I'm in 4x4 it feels like it's engine braking itself (or something similar) and will just creep down the hill as fast as I want it to with the pedal.

What you do is slip the front plastic cover back so you can see the front u-joint (remove one screw to do this). Then you position the back u-joint properly on the driveshaft splines. There is enough spline length so you can then slide the u-joint onto the transmission shaft. You can spin the transmission shaft by hand so the u-joint slides on in position so the roll pin can be inserted through the hole in the shaft. (Might have to take the tractor out of 4WD to do this.)

You first need to understand how to phase the u-joints. Google is your friend.

I have been running in 4WD on both my tractors for 18 and 16 years respectively 99.9 % of the time. But we have hills here. Those who live in flatter areas do not always realize the need. The lost/broken roll pin is the only issue I have experienced.

Also check to find if there is a proper orientation for the slot in the roll pin. I believe the slot should in the direction of the splines, either to the front or the rear. But I am not sure if I remember correctly.

 

[LobsterClaw207]

Again appreciate the help. As soon as I read up on phasing u-joints, it makes complete sense. I looked and it appears they either have an index or something because they appeared to be properly phased already (by accident I guess!. I drove the BX yesterday and it still felt like a clunking under there especially when I was turning the wheel to one side or the other pretty far. I tried wiggling the shaft where it comes forward from the transmission through the bearing portion and it didn't have much if any play, leading me to think that isn't the source of the clunk.

 

[Henro]

Again appreciate the help. As soon as I read up on phasing u-joints, it makes complete sense. I looked and it appears they either have an index or something because they appeared to be properly phased already (by accident I guess!. I drove the BX yesterday and it still felt like a clunking under there especially when I was turning the wheel to one side or the other pretty far. I tried wiggling the shaft where it comes forward from the transmission through the bearing portion and it didn't have much if any play, leading me to think that isn't the source of the clunk.

I can tell you for sure that my BX2200 does NOT have an index or anything to set alignment of the u-joint on the front driveshaft splines. Of course, the u-joint can only go on two ways on the transmission shaft due to the hole for the roll pin.

I suggest you take another look at the phasing. As mentioned previously either above or in another recent thread on the subject, wrong phasing has been the issue (and correcting it the answer) in other threads with the same cause and symptoms as yours.

Granted, you could have a bad u-joint that caused the original issue. But what are the chances? You sensed no vibration before putting the driveshaft back on. Then you did. You also could have got lucky and hit the sweet spot when putting tha u-joint on. Maybe a 1 in 10 chance of that happening?

Not sure about the relationship between the clunking and wheel angle. It looks like wheel angle would not affect the drive shaft, but a change in the angle of the front axle with respect to the frame (Center pivot action) would.

 

[Adam G]

Phasing the u joints just means, aligning the open part of each yoke, front and rear on the same plane, at that point the closed part of yoke will also be on the same plane.
Does that make sense ?

 

[kkk]

Does your front axle have any front to rear play at the "pivot"..?
This seems to be a common issue on that model.....yea I did a bunch of reading.
Check the front axle mounts and be sure the splines(driveline ,yokes,ets) are greased.
I'd jack the front wheels off the ground and spin them....listen or "feel" for wear.
If you just jack 1 up you can then get the front driveline to spin and perhaps see or hear where the issue is.

 

[LobsterClaw207]

@Adam G yup makes total sense. They appear to be aligned the best I can tell.

@kkk It doesn't feel like it, I jacked it up and tried to wiggle it and I didn't feel like it was an excessive amount of play, hardly any.

 

[allnighters1]

Phasing the u joints just means, aligning the open part of each yoke, front and rear on the same plane, at that point the closed part of yoke will also be on the same plane.
Does that make sense ?

 

[shelkol]

The drive shaft can only be out of phase if you split it at the splines and put it back on. If it was out of phase you should actually feel it bind and release sort of like stuttering. (I have first hand knowledge of this lol ) If it is really clunking then I would suspect a u-joint and shaking the shaft should result in no play in the u-joint.

 

[sumpnfishy]

The drive shaft can only be out of phase if you split it at the splines and put it back on. If it was out of phase you should actually feel it bind and release sort of like stuttering. (I have first hand knowledge of this lol ) If it is really clunking then I would suspect a u-joint and shaking the shaft should result in no play in the u-joint.

I know this is an old thread but I've had this issue randomly. Today it fell off while I was in a muddy hole and had a hell of a time getting out. I've never paid attention to phase when reinstalling. Is this what causes enough binding to cause the pin to break? I've never notice anything until I suddenly find I don't have front wheel drive. Then I have to walk around and find the ujoint wherever it fell out and stick it back on. Happens to be every couple of years.

 

[85Hokie]

I know this is an old thread but I've had this issue randomly. Today it fell off while I was in a muddy hole and had a hell of a time getting out. I've never paid attention to phase when reinstalling. Is this what causes enough binding to cause the pin to break? I've never notice anything until I suddenly find I don't have front wheel drive. Then I have to walk around and find the ujoint wherever it fell out and stick it back on. Happens to be every couple of years.

Have you changed your tires since you have had this tractor???? A ratio that has been changed would place a hellva bind in the drive line

 

[TheOldHokie]

I know this is an old thread but I've had this issue randomly. Today it fell off while I was in a muddy hole and had a hell of a time getting out. I've never paid attention to phase when reinstalling. Is this what causes enough binding to cause the pin to break? I've never notice anything until I suddenly find I don't have front wheel drive. Then I have to walk around and find the ujoint wherever it fell out and stick it back on. Happens to be every couple of years.

AFAIK the only thing the pin does os retain the yoke on the shaft. The shaft is splined so the only shear force would be axial. Is the shaft free to telescope as intended? Did you run over anything that might catch and jam the shsft rearward?

Dan

 

[DustyRusty]

If the bearing cap was in the mud, then you should have just replaced the entire universal joint. It is false economy to do the labor required of the job not to install new parts on both ends of the shaft. !500 hours is a lot of time on a tractor, but not a lot of hours if the tractor has been properly maintained during that time. Too many people don't do preventative maintenance, on enough maintenance to wonder what happened when it stopped. There is more to keeping a machine in good repair than just changing the oil and greasing some fittings while you are in there. When something breaks, that is when you find that grease fitting that was so elusive when you had the grease gun in hand.

 

[sumpnfishy]

Have you changed your tires since you have had this tractor???? A ratio that has been changed would place a hellva bind in the drive line

No, the front tires are original (with tubes), the rear I replaced with same size, all turf tires so I wouldn't think they would bind much either.

 

[sumpnfishy]

AFAIK the only thing the pin does os retain the yoke on the shaft. The shaft is splined so the only shear force would be axial. Is the shaft free to telescope as intended? Did you run over anything that might catch and jam the shsft rearward?

Dan

It seems to move freely. I guess its possible I ran over something that pushed the shaft up and away from the yoke. The pin must have already fallen out before that. Now you mention it that makes sense the splines would take the shear force and not the pin. I plan on buying a few pins and make sure and check that more often. Thanks for the input.

 

[sumpnfishy]

If the bearing cap was in the mud, then you should have just replaced the entire universal joint. It is false economy to do the labor required of the job not to install new parts on both ends of the shaft. !500 hours is a lot of time on a tractor, but not a lot of hours if the tractor has been properly maintained during that time. Too many people don't do preventative maintenance, on enough maintenance to wonder what happened when it stopped. There is more to keeping a machine in good repair than just changing the oil and greasing some fittings while you are in there. When something breaks, that is when you find that grease fitting that was so elusive when you had the grease gun in hand.

I hadn't noticed any grease fittings on mine. But I will be sure and check that the pin is in place from now on. Not sure why they randomly fall out. The universal joint was in a dry spot so I just stuck it back on and was good to go after that.