1996 M9000 Fuel Delivery Issues

[paugambi]

Hey all, I just now joined as I need some help with my M9000 that’s been sitting for a couple years.

Go back a couple years ago, and the tractor was running fine, and suddenly it died. It acted like it ran out of fuel. We parked it in front of the barn and... well... here we are.

The other day we did what you’d do for any diesel that’s sat for a while. Primed the pump and let out the air, and figure out if anything was different. It started right up, with absolutely zero issues. As I get down to start checking everything else and start to lower the hood, the engine starts to die down from a high idle, and then it eventually just died. After that we blew out the lines for the vent to the tank, and from the pump on the side of the engine to the tank. An interesting tidbit, when i was blowing air through to the gas tank from the pump, I heard a high pitched sound that sounded much like a dental drill, so I may have instead blown air through the pump...

Regardless, we decided to change the fuel filter today, just in case it was stopped up, primed it, and same exact problem. The engine is definitely getting primed well so I don’t think that I need to bleed at the injector... it’ll run at high idle for a solid minute before it drops down.

So, with the fuel venting cleared up, fuel filter cleared up, and priming done... I’m at a loss. When I prime I do hear some air somewhere, but I can’t pinpoint where. So, what do you guys think my next course of action should be?

Bonus video of the dying characteristics, taken just a few minutes ago.https://youtu.be/7nT0WLw0tmY

 

[Dave_eng]

Hey all, I just now joined as I need some help with my M9000 that’s been sitting for a couple years.

Go back a couple years ago, and the tractor was running fine, and suddenly it died. It acted like it ran out of fuel. We parked it in front of the barn and... well... here we are.

The other day we did what you’d do for any diesel that’s sat for a while. Primed the pump and let out the air, and figure out if anything was different. It started right up, with absolutely zero issues. As I get down to start checking everything else and start to lower the hood, the engine starts to die down from a high idle, and then it eventually just died. After that we blew out the lines for the vent to the tank, and from the pump on the side of the engine to the tank. An interesting tidbit, when i was blowing air through to the gas tank from the pump, I heard a high pitched sound that sounded much like a dental drill, so I may have instead blown air through the pump...

Regardless, we decided to change the fuel filter today, just in case it was stopped up, primed it, and same exact problem. The engine is definitely getting primed well so I don’t think that I need to bleed at the injector... it’ll run at high idle for a solid minute before it drops down.

So, with the fuel venting cleared up, fuel filter cleared up, and priming done... I’m at a loss. When I prime I do hear some air somewhere, but I can’t pinpoint where. So, what do you guys think my next course of action should be?

Bonus video of the dying characteristics, taken just a few minutes ago.https://youtu.be/7nT0WLw0tmY

To narrow down the problem, consider running a temporary fuel supply direct to the injection pump bypassing the tank, lines, filter and mechanical pump.

Some have used a squeeze bottle like a mustard one and a rubber hose.

The goal is to see how the engine acts when it is getting a guaranteed supply of fuel.

Running air backwards through the mechanical pump may not have done its internal check valves any favors.

Dave

 

[paugambi]

To narrow down the problem, consider running a temporary fuel supply direct to the injection pump bypassing the tank, lines, filter and mechanical pump.

Some have used a squeeze bottle like a mustard one and a rubber hose.

The goal is to see how the engine acts when it is getting a guaranteed supply of fuel.

Running air backwards through the mechanical pump may not have done its internal check valves any favors.

Dave

Okie doke, I’ll give that a try tomorrow first thing when i get to it. Will update. Thanks

 

[dvcochran]

Really sounds the restriction issue I had in my M9000 in the line going into the water separator. I had also blown out the lines and that worked for a short time. When it came back I methodically replaced the lines. I found what looked like grass in the line going into the separator. It was far enough back that I could not see it until I cut a couple of inches off the end of the line.

 

[paugambi]

Really sounds the restriction issue I had in my M9000 in the line going into the water separator. I had also blown out the lines and that worked for a short time. When it came back I methodically replaced the lines. I found what looked like grass in the line going into the separator. It was far enough back that I could not see it until I cut a couple of inches off the end of the line.

Did it look like algae or trash in your tank after general use?

 

[dvcochran]

Did it look like algae or trash in your tank after general use?

What was in the line looked like grass. I did drop the tanks and they were surprisingly clean; some hard trash in the bottom of the tanks but nothing that looked like algae. Since replacing the lines it has been running great.

 

[paugambi]

What was in the line looked like grass. I did drop the tanks and they were surprisingly clean; some hard trash in the bottom of the tanks but nothing that looked like algae. Since replacing the lines it has been running great.

Got the lines blown out from the tank and she’s running great now. Planning on running most of the rest of this tank out then draining it. Thanks a lot for the help!

Now to the hydraulics...

 

[leveraddict]

Did you check the air filter and intake? Could be starving for air.

 

[country53]

I had a similar problem with M8200 water separator was plugged where fitting for supply goes in and fitting was loose stuck it under water and pressurized with mouth and saw air bubbles coming out around fitting and then I found after it sat a while it would have air in system, I checked oil level in engine and it was going up so I decided to change water separator, lift pump and fuel filter and it ran fine

 

[dvcochran]

Got the lines blown out from the tank and she’s running great now. Planning on running most of the rest of this tank out then draining it. Thanks a lot for the help!

Now to the hydraulics...

If your machine is like mine you have saddle tanks on both sides of the tractor. The crossover tube is a weird metric size and I was quoted about $60 for the roughly 12" hose. I tried a fuel rated hydraulic hose but it was just small enough not to fit. I reused the old hose. The fuel pickup runs all the way down to the end of the tank nipple for the crossover hose. I did find some trash right at the nipple so I would give it a good look and blast of air.
I even went to far a to buy an inspection camera but it had a really hard time with the glare off the walls and you could not see anything with it. I gave up on it and just dropped the tanks. It is not all that big of a job with a floor jack and an extra set of hands.

 

[paugambi]

I had a similar problem with M8200 water separator was plugged where fitting for supply goes in and fitting was loose stuck it under water and pressurized with mouth and saw air bubbles coming out around fitting and then I found after it sat a while it would have air in system, I checked oil level in engine and it was going up so I decided to change water separator, lift pump and fuel filter and it ran fine

How big of a job is replacing the lift pump? For reference I’ve got the front end loader installed and that makes even replacing the fuel filter a pain.

 

[paugambi]

If your machine is like mine you have saddle tanks on both sides of the tractor. The crossover tube is a weird metric size and I was quoted about $60 for the roughly 12" hose. I tried a fuel rated hydraulic hose but it was just small enough not to fit. I reused the old hose. The fuel pickup runs all the way down to the end of the tank nipple for the crossover hose. I did find some trash right at the nipple so I would give it a good look and blast of air.
I even went to far a to buy an inspection camera but it had a really hard time with the glare off the walls and you could not see anything with it. I gave up on it and just dropped the tanks. It is not all that big of a job with a floor jack and an extra set of hands.

Afraid I’m going to have to do that... it started acting up again. I’m about to get fed up with it enough to call the dealership out to fix it so I don’t have to deal with the headache.

 

[SidecarFlip]

How big of a job is replacing the lift pump? For reference I’ve got the front end loader installed and that makes even replacing the fuel filter a pain.

The lift pump is farther toward the front on the right side and accessible 2 bolts and a couple hoses.

Little hint on the fuel filter, get yourself a pair of oil filter pliers with the 'C' shaped jaws. What I use on my M's, I have loaders on both as well. The filter pliers also work well on the big aluminum nut that secures the sediment bowl. Mine gets stuck regularly so I give it a shot of PBlaster a couple hours before I remove it.

 

[dvcochran]

Afraid I’m going to have to do that... it started acting up again. I’m about to get fed up with it enough to call the dealership out to fix it so I don’t have to deal with the headache.

If your machine has a factory loader it is super easy to take off. In fact the easiest loader I have ever had on/off a tractor. Before removing the hoses as the quick connect take colored tape or numbers or something and identify their location. Getting the hoses swapped around was the only time consuming problem I ever had, and that did not take very long.

 

[country53]

How big of a job is replacing the lift pump? For reference I’ve got the front end loader installed and that makes even replacing the fuel filter a pain.

it is easy Remove lines and 2 10mm hex nuts(6mm studs) and remove

 

[SidecarFlip]

If your machine has a factory loader it is super easy to take off. In fact the easiest loader I have ever had on/off a tractor. Before removing the hoses as the quick connect take colored tape or numbers or something and identify their location. Getting the hoses swapped around was the only time consuming problem I ever had, and that did not take very long.

All good so longs as the hoses are long enough.....lol My open station is a real bear to get the hoses uncopuled and recoupled again. The cab tractor is a snap.

Actually, if he still has the OEM caps on the lines, they are already color coded., white, blue, red and yellow.

 

[SidecarFlip]

You can access the lift pump without removing the loader but the sub frame will still be in the way and while it's removable, it's not worth the effort.