Heat?

[armylifer]

Our 2326 square foot single story house is heated and cooled by a Trane heat pump. I was told by the service tech that it is a 4 ton commercial unit but I have no way of knowing more than that. My whole house is fully electric so the only way to estimate heating cost is to subtract mid summer bill from mid winter bill and call the difference heating cost. That makes it about $150 to heat in mid winter. I heat at 73 degrees. Outside temps at night are around 20 degrees and daytime temps get to mid 30's.

We had one problem where the blower motor burned out about 7 years ago but other than that we have not had any other problems with it. The unit was installed when the house was built in 2003, so I think it is giving good reliable service. The tech told me that the reason the blower motor burned out was because someone set the whole house fan to run continuously while the house was vacant when it was repossessed from the previous owners.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I had an issue with the blower motor (fan) on our +90 Bryant as well. Being a bit handy and good with a voltmeter I diagnosed the issue as a bad start capacitor so I pulled the blower out, took it apart (motor too,), cleaned the squirrel cage fan housing, cleaned the motor inside, relubed the bearings and installed a new start capacitor and all has been good for 3 years now. Furnace blowers are pretty simple inside/

Right now, with the unseasonal warm weather, I have shut down the bio fuel stove and I'm running on propane only. When the temperature gets cold (It will again, I'm sure), I'll fire up the stove again and let it heat the house. Almost January and I have not used a full tank of propane yet 425 gallons and that includes shop heat as well.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I just installed heat pumps, and they have worked well so far down to 12F, they've only been in since October. I have one big compressor and three blower units of different types that supply heat to most of my main floor. Not sure total sq ft but it is a small, old, poorly insulated house. It was a granary first, then the hired man's house, and about 50 years ago completely remodeled. Hand hewn beams. I still have and use a propane fired boiler that runs circulating hot water to baseboard fins as backup. To offset the extra electrical use of the pumps, am in the middle of installing an array of solar panels in the back pasture. It remains to be seen if I have enough panels to get net zero with the power company. It should help to decrease propane usage a lot. My boiler currently still runs domestic hot water, and I need to switch off the heat pumps in case of power failure, my generator can't handle that kind of current draw. Unless you go off the grid entirely, you can't access your own solar generated electricity in the daytime during a power failure. Seems like there should be a workaround for that problem, but one thing at a time.

If I was younger, maybe solar but from my perspective, a water furnace is a better investment. the ROI on solar is way too long, especially here in Michigan to be of any value and the up front cost is too high, plus the raw materials for the panels must be imported from Asia.

I prefer bio fuel and propane or NG if it was available here. With free corn, it's pretty hard not to use it to heat with.

 

[fuzzydawg]

Got a Water Furnace heat pump 3-ton unit installed, with three 100-foot wells for geothermal source. It's a dual capacity unit, runs on low speed most of the time. Has a 10kW electric heater for emergency warmup but it has never been needed (knock on wood). When heating, the unit also heats up the water in the electric water heater, so additional save there. Electric comes from nearby nuclear plant.

Dunno if the tax benefits and electric company rebates still exist, but at the time I was buying, the net cost was too attractive to pass up. My 20-year-old electric furnace was like burning dollar bills to warm up.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Got a Water Furnace heat pump 3-ton unit installed, with three 100-foot wells for geothermal source. It's a dual capacity unit, runs on low speed most of the time. Has a 10kW electric heater for emergency warmup but it has never been needed (knock on wood). When heating, the unit also heats up the water in the electric water heater, so additional save there. Electric comes from nearby nuclear plant.

Dunno if the tax benefits and electric company rebates still exist, but at the time I was buying, the net cost was too attractive to pass up. My 20-year-old electric furnace was like burning dollar bills to warm up.

My good friend and hunting partner installed one in his new home. I think his total utility bill (electric) is 50 bucka a month year around with heat, ac and domestic hot water. He did install a 20KW propane fored genny for backup just in case..

Because we have a lot of dissolved minerals in our well water, he went closed loop, horizontal bored in at 6 feet, 3 loops, filled with Cryotek, smae stuff I use in my shop PEX system. Thermal transfer as good as water with freeze protection to - 50.

 

[timdan94]

I just installed heat pumps, and they have worked well so far down to 12F, they've only been in since October. I have one big compressor and three blower units of different types that supply heat to most of my main floor. Not sure total sq ft but it is a small, old, poorly insulated house. It was a granary first, then the hired man's house, and about 50 years ago completely remodeled. Hand hewn beams. I still have and use a propane fired boiler that runs circulating hot water to baseboard fins as backup. To offset the extra electrical use of the pumps, am in the middle of installing an array of solar panels in the back pasture. It remains to be seen if I have enough panels to get net zero with the power company. It should help to decrease propane usage a lot. My boiler currently still runs domestic hot water, and I need to switch off the heat pumps in case of power failure, my generator can't handle that kind of current draw. Unless you go off the grid entirely, you can't access your own solar generated electricity in the daytime during a power failure. Seems like there should be a workaround for that problem, but one thing at a time.

They do make a grid tie system with battery backup for that reason. It is fairly expensive though

https://www.firemountainsolar.com/shop/diy-grid-tie-solar-kits-for-battery-backup?product_id=1071

 

[SidecarFlip]

Don't see the point in my lifetime at least (solar and wind). Fossil fuels will be the mainstay fuels long after I'm gone. I feel it's nothing more than an expensive folly for the vast majority of people. Fpr some folks that live in the right climate yes, but for most, not really. Friends want me to install solar on the RV. I resist because it's not feasible. My Inverter Genny works just fine.

 

[John T]

Don't see the point in my lifetime at least (solar and wind). Fossil fuels will be the mainstay fuels long after I'm gone. I feel it's nothing more than an expensive folly for the vast majority of people. Fpr some folks that live in the right climate yes, but for most, not really. Friends want me to install solar on the RV. I resist because it's not feasible. My Inverter Genny works just fine.

I had a sit down with the local solar company... Can't remember the exact details, but it didn't make financial sense to go with their deal....
Also, I've heard story's about the poor quality contract/sub installers they use.

The guy down the street had them installed, they have been back 3 times last year to repair things...
I drove by yesterday, they are covered with 2" of frozen snow...

I like my little 30 watt solar panel on the back shed..... keep my tractor battery charged...


as far as wind power, nothing looks worse than an entire mountaintop clearcut and 5 miles of windmills chopping up the birds ....

 

[sheepfarmer]

It all depends on what your home place is like, the price of fossil fuel, and your capabilities. My house doesnt have a good place for an indoor stove. I thought about putting in an outdoor wood boiler to tie into my circulating hot water system. My neighbors have one. Downed trees around here are often free for the cutting up, and I give him mine. But his wife who is much younger than I am is pretty sick of going out and loading up the burner, and reminding him that if she is going to load it those pieces have to be cut up smaller. I decided that's not for me, I am not good with a chain saw. There is still this year a 30% tax rebate on solar installations, and the efficiency of the panels is going up. The payback time if the annual power becomes net 0 could be 10 to 15 years, especially with the reduction in use of propane. As I say we'll see. Trusting the specs is no doubt a gamble, and I have made more than one mistake in my life. I went with an outside company after the one associated with the power company wanted me to sign a contract without details. Bunch of young guys, work really hard, had to change design and location 3 times to come up with one that would work and produce enough power. Produced its first power yesterday, final inspections next week, and a meter change yet.

I like the house warm, and now I will have AC if I want it in the summer. Looking forward to that.

 

[AndyM]

[QUOTE as far as wind power, nothing looks worse than an entire mountaintop clearcut and 5 miles of windmills chopping up the birds ....[/QUOTE]

And they are protected against lawsuits - so they can kill eagles and the like with no consequence. As a big fan of birds I find that environmentalist hypocrisy.

 

[D2Cat]

Sheepfarmer, you have to remember some folks are real outspoken about matters that don't involve them directly! Part of being a keyboard jockey. They'll tell you what they did with the inference you did wrong.

 

[SidecarFlip]

+1 I don't care if you heat your home with dried cow dung and cool it with cold rain water.If it makes you happy, that is all that counts.

Far as birds go, I like them too. I like to eat them.... Especially chickens and ducks.

Far as solar is concerned, we don't live that far from each other and in my view, we don't get enough sun to make it a net 0 proposition and ROI for me is too long at my age.

The company I buy my structural from, the owner don't live far from here and he went solar on his house. He has a fancy system with panels that track the sun automatically and all the bells and whistles and it cost a bundle, even with the government money. I asked him if he was 'making money' on it and his reply was..."not really'. He still uses propane for supplemental heat and in the summer, his ac consumes way more power than the panels produce so the net effect is a little less than break even energy wise. The cost of installation not included.

My heat is basically free (free corn) so that works for me. Every situation demands a different approach.

Good luck with yours. I think you will find out that ypur electricity provider don't pay for power generated by your panels at the same rate you pay them for generated power. He has Consumers and he told me that btw.

I own plenty of acreage to put in a huge solar farm. Not gonna happen here, least not in my lifetime.

 

[John T]

Far as birds go, I like them too. I like to eat them.... Especially chickens and ducks.
..

Thanks a lot.
Now I'm starving...

I think I will text the ole lady to pick up a bag of chix wangs for the smoker today....

boy it's nice to have a week off work....
might have her pick up another half rack of Busch light too...

 

[John T]

https://youtu.be/n9tQ7GAfze4


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[SidecarFlip]

Thanks a lot.
Now I'm starving...

I think I will text the ole lady to pick up a bag of chix wangs for the smoker today....

boy it's nice to have a week off work....
might have her pick up another half rack of Busch light too...

Must be the season (beer drinking). Been picking up tossed beer cans when I walk the big black dopg everyday, usually 5 or 6, tossed out. They go right in the recycle bag. Here it's a dime per. Pays for me walking the mutt.....

 

[John T]

They go right in the recycle bag. Here it's a dime per. Pays for me walking the mutt.....

Thats pretty good.
it's only $0.05 over here... but alcohol tax is high...

the biggest litter problem we see around here is those little plastic "nip" bottles...

they are actually talking about putting a deposit on those also.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Guess our 'springlike' weather is gone. Starting to spit snow here and it's windy too. Probably be lighting up the bio-mass stove layer today to carry most of the heat load. Free corn is good.

 

[Oliver]

Kinda wish there was a can/bottle deposit here, maybe it’d cut down on some of the litter.



You burn corn?

 

[SidecarFlip]

From the amount of cans I pick up when I walk my pups everyday, I'm not sure it would help, but it helps me. I get 'paid' to walk the pups.

On subject..

Getting nasty here and I just fired up the bio-mass stove. No point in blowing though unnecessary propane when the corn is free.

Wife likes it toasty in the house. Candidly, so do I.

 

[Rajjayme]

We have a similar setup to what you described: a central propane furnace and two 500-gallon propane tanks. We find that this is a very cost-effective way to heat our home, and it keeps us nice and cozy during the colder months. Guys from www.energyaustralia.com.au told me some a few tricks on how to save some energy. So, I also have a wood stove that I use to supplement my central heating. I have a lot of lands, so I have plenty of wood to burn. I try to cut and split my wood, but sometimes I have to buy it. I usually burn wood in the evenings and on weekends when I'm home. It's a lot of work, but it's nice to know that I'm not entirely dependent on propane.