L1802 3 point slow when raising

[mrwolfe]

Hi all.

I have an old L1802 that I bought from the previous owner of our property, and it looks like it's spent its entire life out in the rain. The problem I have is the the 3 point is very slow when raising. It drops fast, and the FEL seems to operate as it should. I replaced the canister filter a few months ago, as well as the transmission fluid when both the 3 point and FEL started getting slow.

Changing the filter and fluid fixed the FEL, but the 3 point is still slow, especially when warm. I'm wondering if there is another filter somewhere. I have read about a filter screen that can be taken out and cleaned on some models. Anyone know if there is, and where it might be?

 

[Missouribound]

Hitch or remotes fails to lift or lifts slowly
1 Excessive load on hitch or remotes Reduce load.
2 Low oil level Fill system with proper oil.
3 Hydraulic oil too cold Allow oil to warm.
4 Remote flow control in slow position Move to fast position.
5 Hydraulic oil filter plugged Replace filter. * Examine filter or cut apart to check for foreign contamination.
6 Hydraulic pump pickup screen plugged Clean or replace pickup screen. * Examine screen to check for foreign contamination.
7 Electrical failure - only applies to newer tractors Refer to service manual. * Broken wires, bad connections, switches or computer.
8 High pressure internal leak or relief valve malfunctioning Refer to service manual to correct leak or replace relief valve.
9 Hydraulic or hitch system internal valves stuck, broken or springs broke Refer to service manual to find and correct malfunctioning parts.
10 Draft control cylinder scored/seal leaking or "raise" circuit leak Refer to service manual to find and correct leak.
11 Hydraulic pump failure Flo-rate pump and replace if necessary.

Perhaps you can call the dealer and have him give you advice.....or bring it to him.

 

[mrwolfe]

Hi Missouribound. Thanks for replying.

I've inserted responses below:

1 Excessive load on hitch or remotes Reduce load.

It's slow to raise with NO load on it. I have a posthole digger on it at the moment. I can raise it by hand, and once up it stays up. but it won't lift any weight at all.

2 Low oil level Fill system with proper oil.

Yep, thought of that. If anything it's a little over full

3 Hydraulic oil too cold Allow oil to warm.

It seems to work better when cold

4 Remote flow control in slow position Move to fast position.

The flow knob is seized in the "fast" position. It falls quickly, but raises very slowly.

5 Hydraulic oil filter plugged Replace filter. * Examine filter or cut apart to check for foreign contamination.

Replaced the filter with Kubota Genuine when I changed the transmission oil.

6 Hydraulic pump pickup screen plugged Clean or replace pickup screen. * Examine screen to check for foreign contamination.

About that, do you know where the screen might be on an L1802?

7 Electrical failure - only applies to newer tractors Refer to service manual. * Broken wires, bad connections, switches or computer.

N/A

8 High pressure internal leak or relief valve malfunctioning Refer to service manual to correct leak or replace relief valve.

About that, any idea where to get a service manual. My local dealer tells me that there is no such thing as an L1802 Kubota

9 Hydraulic or hitch system internal valves stuck, broken or springs broke Refer to service manual to find and correct malfunctioning parts.

As above

10 Draft control cylinder scored/seal leaking or "raise" circuit leak Refer to service manual to find and correct leak.

As above

11 Hydraulic pump failure Flo-rate pump and replace if necessary.

I think the pump is probably OK. The FEL works fine, and easily lifts 1/2 ton. It's just the 3-point that won't lift.

Perhaps you can call the dealer and have him give you advice.....or bring it to him

I've already talked to my local dealer. He tried to tell me that there is no such Kubota as an L1802. Consequently, I can't get a manual and he doesn't even want to think about supplying parts.

 

[Roadworthy]

Since you're working on one you can be pretty sure there really is a L1802. http://www.tractordata.com/farm-tractors/007/7/7/7773-kubota-l1802.html
I believe your problem is Kubota never imported that model into this country. That makes it a grey market tractor and dealers do not support those. You can get a manual online but not from Kubota. Interestingly it was made by Kubota though the sheet metal may have been made by Daedong of Korea. They shared technology but had a falling out. That is where Kioti came from.

 

[mrwolfe]

What is interesting is that if I stop the engine, put the 3-point control lever in the "up" position and then start the engine, the 3-point will go all the way up, although it won't lift any real weight. Only does it on startup though. If I drop the 3-point and try to raise it with the engine running, it won't raise.

I have managed to get hold of an L245 manual. The troubleshooting chart in the section on hydraulics leads me to believe it is probably a sticky pressure relief valve. Only problem is that I don't know where the valve is. There is a cross-section diagram of the valve, but no pictures of what it looks like or where it is

Anyone have any ideas?

 

[bucktail]

If it's the pressure relief valve, and if the FEL is working well and the 3ph isn't, either plumbing for the FEL has bypassed the pressure relief valve. Might be that the cylinder that runs your 3ph needs a new O-ring.

 

[billrigsby]

Since you're working on one you can be pretty sure there really is a L1802. http://www.tractordata.com/farm-tractors/007/7/7/7773-kubota-l1802.html
I believe your problem is Kubota never imported that model into this country. That makes it a grey market tractor and dealers do not support those. You can get a manual online but not from Kubota. Interestingly it was made by Kubota though the sheet metal may have been made by Daedong of Korea. They shared technology but had a falling out. That is where Kioti came from.

Closest US equivalent is going to be a L235

 

[mrwolfe]

Actually, the FEL does get a bit slow after an hour or two, and responds the same way - quicker immediately after starting the engine, although it does lift. I suspect that is because it's a different arrangement that doesn't need as much pressure. I don't think there are any leaks in the cylinders because the 3-point and FEL will stay up overnight. I just need to know where to find that relief valve so I can pull it out and check it.

 

[mrwolfe]

OK, time for an update.

I finally found the pressure relief valve. It's on the left side of the hydraulic housing, just behind the supply connection. Mine is an L1802DT, but the 2WD version is probably similar.

Getting the relief valve out was a bit tricky with it on the tractor, so I pulled the whole housing. Inside I found a couple of small pieces of what at first looked like gravel.

They are actually pieces of something made of a soft plastic or something. I don't know where they are from.

Anyway, cleaned the relief valve up and put it back, hoping I might have found the culprit.

But no. Still the same problem. 3 point will only lift briefly when the engine starts, then nothing. Once it's up it stays up, but won't lift any weight.

So now I'm thinking I might have the wrong filter. My thinking is that the filter is on the suction side of the pump. When I turn the engine off, the filter gradually allows enough oil into the pump to raise the 3 point a bit when I start the engine back up, but then the filter collapses and staves the pump.

The filter I fitted came in a set of filters I got from JTP, which included a genuine Kubota 30400-37710 hydraulic filter. Looking over this thread, it appears that the correct filter may be 38430-37710, not the 30400-37710 that JTP supplied in their "L1802 DT Complete Filter Set".

Now, the filter I have on the tractor at the moment (30400-37710) matches the one that I replaced, but neither have the funny little "nut" thing on top that the TI158 filter (aftermarket replacement for 38430-37710 it seems) has. I replaced the filter because the hydraulics were starting to get slow, and initially it made a difference. So now I'm coming to the conclusion that the previous owner replaced the filter with the wrong type, then I replaced it again with the wrong type supplied by JTP, not knowing any different.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

The new filters won't have the nut on them anymore, it's just different cases.

The material from the Pressure relief, looks like the backup ring on the three point cylinder, Have you rebuilt the cylinder yet?

 

[mrwolfe]

No, haven't rebuilt the cylinder. The system holds pressure, so I'm pretty sure there are no leaks in the valves or the cylinder.

To test the filter theory, I pulled the new filter off and replaced it with the old one that I still had lying around (seat side down on an oil pan, so no dust settling in it). The difference was immediate. Suddenly it will pull the posthole digger out of the ground, where it was struggling just to lift it before.

So now I'm wondering if there is a hydraulic screen in the L1802. So far, I haven't found any information that says there is one, although the L245 has one on the left hand side opposite the hydraulic pickup line. My next post will tell of any discoveries I have made .

 

[mrwolfe]

...or not. The hydraulics work when the tractor is cold, but everything slows to a crawl when it's been running for a while. To the point where the FEL is struggling to raise after 30 minutes.

I'm thinking it might be the pump.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

...or not. The hydraulics work when the tractor is cold, but everything slows to a crawl when it's been running for a while. To the point where the FEL is struggling to raise after 30 minutes.

I'm thinking it might be the pump.

Or a low suction / clogged filter issue.

 

[RicePaddyFrog]

Hey there,

I'm not too familiar with the 1800 series, but I am rebuilding a Zennoh 2000 and had the same problem.
There is a 'Hydraulic Screen' bolt in the return line that bolts the line to the hydraulic fluid chamber. If it is even lightly clogged the 3pt starts acting slow and soon after it will lift once or twice then dead!

This seems to be a general problem as my Kubota B5001 had exactly the same issue.

Good luck though!

 

[mrwolfe]

Thanks for that SDV. You wouldn't have the part number for the correct filter, would you? I have a genuine Kubota filter on the machine.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Thanks for that SDV. You wouldn't have the part number for the correct filter, would you? I have a genuine Kubota filter on the machine.

Look under the main page it has a list of filters for the grey's.

https://www.orangetractortalks.com/

 

[mrwolfe]

Look under the main page it has a list of filters for the grey's.

https://www.orangetractortalks.com/

There are lists for the Air, Fuel amd Engine oil filters, but none for the hydraulic/transmission oil filter. Or am I missing something?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

There are lists for the Air, Fuel and Engine oil filters, but none for the hydraulic/transmission oil filter. Or am I missing something?

Sorry, I thought that hydraulic filters were on that list too.
Send Service Department Vic an email or a PM and see if he can tell you the proper filter number.

 

[mrwolfe]

OK, more on the 3 point saga.

Replaced the pump. It's not that.

I'm still trying to figure the filter thing out. Today I went down to my local Kubota dealer and asked for a 38430-37710 filter. He doesn't have any in stock. Apparently they are no longer avaiable, having been replaced with 30400-37710. I already have a new 30400-37710 filter on the tractor, and it has a paper element. He suggested that the oil could be too thick, said he'd seen that a lot.

Next thing to figure out is what grade of oil is correct for the L1802. I have Agritrans 10W-30 UTTO GL4 in it at the moment, which is what was in it when I got the tractor. It looks like the correct grade is 10W-20. I replaced the oil with the same stuff, so maybe that was the problem.

 

[gacarr]

I have the ZL1802. Mine has a valve right in front of the seat that controls the speed of the lift. I have to open it a little during cold weather.