Repair ? or do a total rebuild ?

[Kabota]

Well This is a sleeved engine and the $500 kit includes sleeves and pistons.

Not presently taking classes but I do have a high quality boring head that I never used but maybe some day when I am 80 I will try to use it on a Kohler

So why even go to diesel school when you can learn it all from watching youtube videos

Besides, if you sleep at a Holiday Inn Express the night before, you wont need experience or even training

So if I do this rebuild and it is successful should I conclude that I was lucky or should I assume that I knew what I was doing?

And btw if you know what you are doing ... how many hours would it take you to install crank bearings, re-sleave and install pistons ? I plan on having the new head done by a pro using parts from the old head as long as they are in good condition. Also some have suggested new injectors and pump so is that something a qualified person should do ?

 

[Kabota]

So what happens when one turns 80? Does he need to do additional work to it now to make it there?

I donno but what bothers me is that I will be there in 15 years (maybe)

 

[Jim L.]

And btw if you know what you are doing ... how many hours would it take you to install crank bearings, re-sleave and install pistons ? I plan on having the new head done by a pro using parts from the old head as long as they are in good condition. Also some have suggested new injectors and pump so is that something a qualified person should do ?

Not sure what would be done by a pro on a new head.

Injectors and pump can be tested by a shop while you are working on other things. Re-installing injectors is not a high skill level task.

Whatever shop hours would be listed for tasks will have little relation to your hours. It will take you longer. Also, you will be examining everything and someone on the clock would not waste time doing that. Plan on weeks to get this done and if completed early, it will be a pleasant surprise for you.

 

[Kabota]

Not sure what would be done by a pro on a new head.

Injectors and pump can be tested by a shop while you are working on other things. Re-installing injectors is not a high skill level task.

Whatever shop hours would be listed for tasks will have little relation to your hours. It will take you longer. Also, you will be examining everything and someone on the clock would not waste time doing that. Plan on weeks to get this done and if completed early, it will be a pleasant surprise for you.

Yep I will go slow and get lots of advice along the way. Will get advice here and I know some schooled diesel mechanics also. I need to wait till after Xmas to free up room in my 24 x 32 foot garage.... need to have a dedicated spot to do the rebuild ... Fortunately I have free gas. January will be plowing snow and dedicated to this tractor.

And thanks to you all for your remarks ... I am learning a lot from this forum

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

You will need a machine shop to remove, install, and bore the sleeves.
You'll be able to do everything else yourself.
Going rates varies but plan on anywhere up to about $1000 to have all the macineshop work done, so a $500 rebuild kit turns into $1500 instantly.

Have the Injection pump and Injectors tested then if needed, replace or rebuilt.
The head is rather easy and simple to set up, you will just need a machine shop to grind the valves.

Everything else is relatively simple to tackle.

 

[Kabota]

Wow thanks to a friend here who sent me a link to an Ebay listing for a Starrett inside micrometer set with ten rods and can measure 2 inches to 12 inches. This is a vintage set pre owned by a master machinist who took good care of his tools. Got it for $99

It is paid for and on its way !!!

Thanks to you who sent me the link

Now pesky neighbors will be after me to measure their bores !

..... but that is ok because I borrow their stuff.

I have outside micrometers calipers and dial indicator so this is just the tool I needed.

Otherwise it is time to quit borrowing neighbors torque wrench...

(Hoping Santa reads this post)

Sooooo just got back from the local diner ... a friend of mine is leasing this place for a year with an option to buy. Her son was there helping today so I asked him where he worked.... turns out he is a mechanic and went to a diesel tech school.

Yep I think if I go slow and get lots of advice I will be ok

Actually I did not want a project tractor.... but now am getting excited about doing this engine !!!

 

[Jim L.]

Otherwise it is time to quit borrowing neighbors torque wrench...

This seems to be a nit-picky comment now, but it won't be when you torque the head bolts to spec. Whatever torque wrench you use must be calibrated.

A borrowed one should have a current calibration sticker. Very doubtful that your neighbor has ever done that. Or you can buy a digital torque meter to test and set the torque wrench that you will use. Also, match the range of the torque wrench to the head bolt torque. That way you will have more accurate results.

Maybe Santy has one for your stocking.

 

[Kabota]

This seems to be a nit-picky comment now, but it won't be when you torque the head bolts to spec. Whatever torque wrench you use must be calibrated.

A borrowed one should have a current calibration sticker. Very doubtful that your neighbor has ever done that. Or you can buy a digital torque meter to test and set the torque wrench that you will use. Also, match the range of the torque wrench to the head bolt torque. That way you will have more accurate results.

Maybe Santy has one for your stocking.

Thanks !!!!! I did not know they need to be calibrated. My neighbor farms and is a fairly good mechanic ..... even torques the bolts when he changes wheels on his car !!!!

 

[torch]

. even torques the bolts when he changes wheels on his car !!!!

That's the rule, not the exception.

Insufficiently tightened wheel nuts can cause them to vibrate off, which can ruin your day.

Overtightened wheel nuts can cause the studs to break, which can ruin your day.

Unequally torqued wheel nuts, on today's cars that secure the lightweight brake rotors with said wheel nuts, might not ruin your day but can ruin your rotor (by warping it).

 

[Kabota]

You will need a machine shop to remove, install, and bore the sleeves.
You'll be able to do everything else yourself.
Going rates varies but plan on anywhere up to about $1000 to have all the macineshop work done, so a $500 rebuild kit turns into $1500 instantly.

Have the Injection pump and Injectors tested then if needed, replace or rebuilt.
The head is rather easy and simple to set up, you will just need a machine shop to grind the valves.

Everything else is relatively simple to tackle.

Well that machine shop fee sounds a bit high ....we will see

Hey my neighbor has one of those shop presses with the little red bottle jack on it....

 

[Kabota]

Before I post I just want to say thanks to all of you who have replied with helpful advice.

The tractor is outside in the cold with the loader still mounted. Plan is to start splitting tractor January 1st because other project is occupying garage space and that project needs to be finished first.

So while still outside I decided to do more initial assessment and found some disturbing issues.

Pulled the crankcase oil dipstick and was full to the top of the dipstick !!!!

So assumed water may have entered crankcase.

So I removed the plug and out came 2 1/2 quarts of green water...

So I put plug back in when oil started running out.

Then skimmed oil off the top and tested antifreeze and found to be good to -16 degrees Fahrenheit ... which is risky in my part of the world.... but have not seen -20 in quite a few years. -32 is all time record low here.

Head was off when I bought the tractor and so I looked down into water jacket surrounding cylinders and saw water. Measured water and was 2 3/4 inch deep and maybe 1 1/4 inches from top of the block.

Loader is keeping me from dropping the pan or I would drop it to see if crank and cam shaft are rusty.

I have a question..........

When water gets into the crankcase of a running engine the oil turns medium gray color. Will the oil and water eventually separate so that the water becomes clear again and the oil becomes black again ?

Head is cracked but possibly not due to freezing.... if it did freeze would the water jacket around the cylinders also crack draining the water from the jacket?

I paid $1475 for this tractor which came with a new head. Tractor has loader and like new tires and is 4wd..... so I did not over pay for it even if block is broke. Previous owner did body work on an antique truck and the man did not have cash to pay him so he took this Kubota project in lieu of cash. Tractor was already torn down (had head removed) when he acquired it.

I will probably take off the loader soon so I can remove the oil pan .... other wise this project is on hold till Jan 1 2009.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

other wise this project is on hold till Jan 1 2009.

Well then give that's almost 10 years ago, it's done right.


Older Kubotas are know for head issues, I've yet to see a block that cracked from over heat or freezing, I have seen a couple with holes punched in them from flying rods.

I've seen quite a few filled with water and they didn't do any damage at all to any of the oiled parts like the crank and bearing surfaces, most of the time it doesn't even phase the outsides as they were oil soaked before the water got to it.

 

[Kabota]

I think what I meant to say is this old tractor was torn down back about 2009.

Any way Wolfman thanks for the encouragement. Water probably went down the hole that the push rod comes up through. 2 1/2 qts is a lot but water from radiator would continue to flow into water jacket until water level in the radiator was same level as the crack in the head. Tomorrow I will take a pic of the old head ... crack is small but visible. BTW push rods are not rusry.

I have some experience with a Yanmar. Was buying a JD 655 with bad 16 diesel hp engine .... wanted to buy just the loader but seller did not want to separate. Engine had the air cleaner removed and hood was removed while tractor sat outside for 7 years. Dipstick showed way overfilled level. So removed oil plug and out came 1 1/2 qt clear rain water and then 2 1/2 qt oil. Was a low hour tractor which suddenly lost all compression.... my theory is tractor would not start and so was given a shot of ether. Anyway rain water going into air intake manifold en route to crank case is not a good scenario. Some day when I am bored I may pull the head off or otherwise will make a great boat anchor!

 

[D2Cat]

I still think you ought to switch your front tires side to side! With your user name and pictures of your tractor .... maybe the comment about location of CL picture applies here?

 

[Kabota]

I still think you ought to switch your front tires side to side! With your user name and pictures of your tractor .... maybe the comment about location of CL picture applies here?

Oh now you are mixing the contents of two different threads .... is that legal to do here

Really you need to get to know West Virginians like I know them...

Blondes tell Blonde jokes and laugh at them

West Virginians do the same

As for those backwards front treads .... I have a theory but it belongs in my other thread...

.............. well maybe not because maybe belongs in the Tires and Wheels Forum.

Yes ... tomorrow I will post pic of those tires on the Kubota so that you can stop by and chime in with you wit.... which will be followed by my logical explanation for why a person mounts fronts backwards on a tractor primarily used for loading.

 

[Kabota]

Ok I asked a question about gray oil !

Gray oil is the result of water mixing with oil in a running engine.

My question is will the gray oil eventually separate back into clear water and black oil ?

Or is there some permanent homogenization or emulsification going on here ?

Is there a chemist in the house ?

.... not that I have gray oil in the Gray market tractor because I don't.

But if gray water can separate into clear water and black oil .... then there could have once been gray oil in this gray market tractor !!!!!

 

[torch]

My question is will the gray oil eventually separate back into clear water and black oil ?

Yes, absolutely.