Making wood pellets

[CaveCreekRay]

There's a furniture factory in Mesa that used to throw away literally tons of hardwood scraps each month, mostly oak. And on top of that there were huge bags of saw dust.

Anyone near the Mt Airy furniture factories in North Carolina would be in hog heaven making this stuff. Can you say "retirement bonanza?" Two or three plants could supply a pellet mill 7 days a week.

 

[ShaunRH]

The issue I have with pellets is that they are highly variable, even in the same 'line' of pellets. My fathers pellet stove/heater has trouble with most brands, but it's doing okay with the "Heatr's" from Home Despot, however it varies with the line. Some pallets do great, others burn less efficient.

Humidity, makeup of the pellet (NO BARK!), etc. all have a large effect on it.

I may go pellet stove for our granny house in Texas but I think I might do propane/wood heat for the main home.

Pellets seem to be unpredictable.

 

[Tooljunkie]

The ring die style press is better suited for hardwood, it can withstand the pressure needed for hardwood. Its also more efficient. But 4x the price of the flat die press.possibly more. I have an abundance of spruce available. Will mix it with a small amount of hardwood in hopes it wont push the limits of the press. Did poplar(aspen) last year, was fine sawmill dust and difficult to bind.

Its true pellets vary in quality, some burn well some hardly at all. Had one brand had very long pellets 2" maybe. Auger would break them and create dust which in turn bound up the auger. 4 times in 3 days. I was having fits.
Dusty pellets will do this too. Handling your bags without tossing around
like sacks of cement will aid in reducing dust.
When i buy pellets, i try to get the whole seasons worth in the house before it gets cold. Saves energy. Door isnt open while we carry 50 bags of pellets in and bringing in frozen pellets will suck up moisture.

 

[RCW]

Being in the northeast US, everybody is looking for hardwood pellets. Probably a throw-back to everybody burning hardwood for firewood. Softwood is often used for heat in many places. I've used mixed soft/hardwood often without issue.

Pellets do vary - its a plant material extruded into pellets. Things will change from batch to batch. You deal with variety when burning firewood - its just the nature of what you do. But, when you burn firewood, you can compensate for the variety. The pellet stove only allows a few operator changes.

Some stoves are more tolerant than others for varieties. Mine will burn about anything and (I shouldn't say this) has never bound up in 10 years. But others burn better than mine and jam more - just the variety of stoves.

Variety - the spice of life!

 

[skeets]

Just a wonder, has or do any companies mix in a coal dust with the wood? I dont know if it would make a difference with the burn rate or dust or ash, or if it would even bind with the wood,, I was wondering

 

[Tooljunkie]

40 pounds of hard or soft wood pellets still make about the same heat. They are both compressed to similar density. So in a woodstove- hardwood good. Yup.
The big issue to some is ash.

 

[CaveCreekRay]

I was reading today on hearth.com about the CO levels that come off supplies of pellets stored in confined places. Whooda thunkit? Just by compression of wood material, you set off a chemical process that produces monoxide in high levels. I have been a woodworker all my life and have never heard of such a thing...

Wow! Be careful out there.

 

[Grouse Feathers]

Just a wonder, has or do any companies mix in a coal dust with the wood? I dont know if it would make a difference with the burn rate or dust or ash, or if it would even bind with the wood,, I was wondering

Without out coal there would have been no industrial revolution and technology would be little advanced beyond the iron age. It is and was a necessity to life as we know it. Coal is also bad stuff and we need to move on to other fuels. We can't just shut it off, but we don't need to be looking for additional uses for burning coal. Coal dust can also be a fire and explosive hazard that needs to be stored and handled properly.

 

[skeets]

There was a bumper sticker in the lamp room of one of my mines I inspected, it was all black with the picture of a coal fired power plant. And printed over that in red letters it said,,,,
Ban mining
,,,, and let the bastards freeze in the dark,,,

Solar has not evolved far enough, wind is if'y at best, and hydro while it is 7/24 unless there's a drought, and of course nuclear power ( remember 3 mile island and japan?).. Gas power plants do not produce the amounts of power that coal does, there for you need larger plants burning more gas,,
And until they come up with butterfly power or some such silly thing, coal is the best cheapest and plentiful and MOST regulated of all these power producers

 

[Grouse Feathers]

There was a bumper sticker in the lamp room of one of my mines I inspected, it was all black with the picture of a coal fired power plant. And printed over that in red letters it said,,,,
Ban mining
,,,, and let the bastards freeze in the dark,,,

Solar has not evolved far enough, wind is if'y at best, and hydro while it is 7/24 unless there's a drought, and of course nuclear power ( remember 3 mile island and japan?).. Gas power plants do not produce the amounts of power that coal does, there for you need larger plants burning more gas,,
And until they come up with butterfly power or some such silly thing, coal is the best cheapest and plentiful and MOST regulated of all these power producers

I believe you spent some time in coal mines, I spent 37 years in power plants, coal, oil, and natural gas. To make coal clean will make it more expensive than natural gas and utilities are having just as much trouble getting a coal plant approved as a nuclear plant. We need to replace the coal at a reasonable pace with economic alternatives that make sense. Probably includes natural gas, solar, and nuclear (the real price of wind power is comparable to nuclear and is even higher if you add in a back up supply for calm days).

To the point of the thread there is no clean coal in a pellet stove. London was a warm but unhealthy city when every house burned coal for heat.

 

[ShaunRH]

There was a bumper sticker in the lamp room of one of my mines I inspected, it was all black with the picture of a coal fired power plant. And printed over that in red letters it said,,,,
Ban mining
,,,, and let the bastards freeze in the dark,,,

Solar has not evolved far enough, wind is if'y at best, and hydro while it is 7/24 unless there's a drought, and of course nuclear power ( remember 3 mile island and japan?).. Gas power plants do not produce the amounts of power that coal does, there for you need larger plants burning more gas,,
And until they come up with butterfly power or some such silly thing, coal is the best cheapest and plentiful and MOST regulated of all these power producers

All of the nuclear accidents are on un-contained Nuclear plants. None of the fully contained 2nd gen plants have had these issues. 3rd Gen plants would be impossible to melt down and would reprocess their fuel on site resulting in low radioactivity waste, would not even need significant confinement protection.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_III_reactor

It is my understanding that there has been no deaths from Fukushima and no significant cancer increase or expected decreases of lifespan in the Chernobyl plume area.

I strongly recommend this movie: http://pandoraspromise.com/

It shows both sides of the argument and takes a REAL look at the nuclear power industry from people that were committed to the truth, not their agendas.

As far as coal goes, a modern coal plant emits less pollution than a natural gas plant and certainly less than an oil plant. If the coal plants get retro fitted, they will actually be greener than solar or wind.

 

[skeets]

You guys have some very good points, and yes i spent 35 years working for the gubbermint inspection underground and surface mines as an electrical spec. The laws on the books right now per EPA regs have an upper limit on coal for sulphur, carbon, BTU rating, and over all noxious gasses produced and trust me they are strictly enforced with some rather large fins being leveler to the coal producers and the power industry. Be that as it may, the problem as I see it, stems from the fact that WE as America is doing great things to improve the air and water quality, are faced with country's that could give two hoots about them. One being directly to our south and the rest pretty much all the way down to the cape. And I do know for a fact that some manufactures of charcoal , do infact mix a small amount of coal dust in with their products for the ease of starting, Kingsford being one of them.
Anyway guys have a most wonderful and enjoyable weekend and thanks for the interesting, and informative side comments
Peace
Skeets

 

[Tooljunkie]

Back to the question at hand, i could see the benefit of coal dust in wood pellets, but it being non compressible and abrasive i dont think i would want to run it through my press.

Be a week before i can start lining up my machines for pelleting,or chipping. Off to visit family out west.

Chipping and hammering. Should go quick i hope. Then to build a cyclone or two. Makes filling storage bin easier.

 

[tempforce]

photo's i don't see any photo's... or a video....
i need some photo's
thanks..

 

[ShaunBlake]

... None of the fully contained 2nd gen plants have had these issues. 3rd Gen plants would be impossible to melt down...

It is my understanding that there has been no deaths from Fukushima and no significant cancer increase or expected decreases of lifespan in the Chernobyl plume area.

... If the coal plants get retro fitted, they will actually be greener than solar or wind.

Agreed. Nuclear is only dangerous when improperly designed and constructed (according to current-at-the-time guidelines).

I strongly differ with you about both Japan's and Russia's results. It is my understanding that evidence of Chernobyl 'victim harm' has been contained by isolating everyone exposed, and permitting them to expire in isolation.

I have read of similar efforts to control the leaking of information about workers and civilians who were exposed both in the Fukushima meltdown and the clean-up.

That being said, it is all propaganda, and both sides routinely attempt to enfold huge lies within tiny grains of truth.

Agreed that coal-powered plants could be made even cleaner -- but at huge cost. What's worse, the power companies have gotten clever and in some areas (I'm in Jawjuh, where their lobbyists have been particularly successful), they are compelling the customer base to fund the future clean-up by increasing the current rates to cover the estimated costs -- no out-of-pocket expense to the companies. Of course, this guarantees that the companies will have no exposure should there be cost-overruns. <sigh>

Just one more reason to get off the grid (the electric-power grid, anyway) or move to an area with 20th- or 21st-century power service.

Oops! My soapbox can't take the weight of cantankerous old fat guys stamping their feet and whining that life isn't fair... help! <crash>

 

[skeets]

Yeah Frank I hadnt thought about how abrasive the coal dust would be on the dies, and roller.
And I ask are you using any thing as a binding agent like a starch or some kind of glue. Or is it just moisture and heat, and pressure that holds things together?

 

[armylifer]

I think that this thread is getting off the original subject. I want to see some pictures and some video of a press that can produce wood pellets. I do not give a damn about the politics of alternative fuels or nuclear power plants. I just care about heating my home as cheaply as possible. If someone can help me do that, I don't care if it is green or if it stinks up the world. Just show me a way to heat my home without driving me to the poorhouse.

 

[skeets]

LMAO @ Armylifter,, I hear ya, brudder, I hear ya

 

[Tooljunkie]

Jeez...
This is my pellet mill, flat die style. Kubota runs it with no effort. 768 us dollars. By the time i got it home was double that price.

http://youtu.be/L50OeqqceDk
Try that.

 

[skeets]

OK so what did I miss? first sawdust then you ran the pellets through again? A dumb question maybe, but WHY?