B3350 dpf issues

[MisterScott]

If you add a turbo, your's will be the first hot, "Twin Turbo" B3350, as it has one turbocharger already .

There's a computer that monitors DPF temperatures, pre-DPF exhaust pressure, but not post DPF pressure (no Delta-P) as in some of the bigger tractors - and the display doesn't tell you what the percentage of DPF loading is, so Auto Regens are mostly a suprise (not very convenient, but I have stopped them with no issues, usually right away if I am not going to be running the tractor for long enough for it to finish). The injection timing is retarded to increase exhaust temperatures so the DPF works better. If the DPF were to fall off, the injection would want to be advanced for better power and economy.

I don't know if any DPF removal kits or parts or computer re-mapping. But we can hope.

Ha! I had no idea it was turbo motor. Have not had a chance to play with it since last Friday. Kids football and soccer. I just assumed at that horsepower rating there was no turbo.

 

[tempforce]

i read somewhere that kubota uses a sound wave technology to sense the amount of soot buildup in the 3350's dpf. thus no delta p sensors on both ends.

 

[MisterScott]

It should be easy to make a defeat system. Removing the DPF is easy and bolting/welding a through pipe should be doable. Capping the sensors with a some type of capacitor that always registers a clean signal is a way it has been done in the past on diesel pickups. Also you can put a programmer on it that clears the codes and retunes the engine for "normal" operation - i.e., more and efficient power production.

 

[skeets]

Ahhhhuummmmm you dont work for VW do you

 

[MisterScott]

Ahhhhuummmmm you dont work for VW do you

If I did we wouldn't be having these problems now would we.

 

[skeets]

I really think the problem is in the dilithum chamber suffering from a magnetic flux imbalance

 

[MisterScott]

I really think the problem is in the dilithum chamber suffering from a magnetic flux imbalance

The more yee overthink the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain.

Literally true in our cases with DPF.

 

[MisterScott]

Skeets, what year and make is your Harley? I have a 2015 CVO Road Glide. Good riding in PA.

 

[Burt]

I have a B3350 tier 4 machine used for snowblowing and I have 50 hours on the machine the DPF has been replaced 3 times the computer once. I am continuing to have issues with the DPF not regenerating Kubota states the cold weather is the reason any help or tips would be welcome.

jhodgins94,

After reading this entire blog this morning and understanding more about the problems of DPF's, regens, and other mandated engine add-ons, an analogy came to mind.

If this were the 1800's, and cowboy days when everything was done by horse, oxen, ass, donkey, mule and human backs, imagine that the government required horse owners to put a mixture into their oats, no, required all oats to have it. They told you that the horse poop would smell better as a result.

The unsuspecting cowboys tried it willingly.

Then a few of their horses tired during normal activity and even pulling plows.

Now in those days, communications was slow and it took a long time for word to get around.

One day, a Doctor studied this problem and came up to the scientific fact that the new government oats was slowly killing their horses and cattle. It was a slow process and wasn't fully realized until Tim O'Shaughnessy's oxen went down along with two draught horses.

Tim was distraught. He had saved most of his life for the draught horses and still owed money on them. He ran into town screaming "THE GOVERNMENT IS KILLING OUR HORSES, THE GOVERNMENT IS KILLING OUR HORSES!"

Well, you can imagine what happened then.

Tim was arrested and charged with treason.

It's the same story. It's later and they're killing our engines at our expense.

Burt

 

[MisterScott]

I have owned a number of post-2007.5 diesel HD pickups, all Dodges and Fords. There are three general environmentally driven systems on the new trucks: DPF (diesel particulate filter which traps soot), EGR (exhaust gas recirculation which is a NOX inhibitor that mixes pre-DPF exhaust with intake air) and urea injection post combustion which I believe is a NOX and SOX inhibitor.

Let's pick them apart. DPF is designed to trap the particulate matter created by diesel engines - the soot that coes from "rolling coal". It is generally a large expensive cannister in line in the exhaust system. As ek know DPF's fill up an need to regenerate or clean themselves. DPF's create back pressure on the engine and other components. They require additional fuel to go through regeneration cycles which heats up the DPF above the temperature at which the soot burns. This very negatively affects fuel economy as more fuel - not used for propulsion - is the heat source for burning the soot and cleaning the DPF.

DPF's are very expensive and use precious metals. There have a rash of thefts where theives will slide under the truck and un bolt them - they are usually bolted in series with flanges. They cost at least a couple of grand to replace.

They also seem to have a shelf life depending on usage. They do go bad after time. I am hesring 80K miles on some trucks. Trucks will also go into limp mode (reduced power) if the DPF gets full and cannot regenerate which requires a 25 mile drive on the highway.

Ford and Dodge use the exhaust stroke to facilitate the regen cycle which dumps raw diesel into the exhaust stroke which then is blown down into the DPF and causes it to heat up and burn the soot. Regens do not work at idle or driving around town - they require trips on the highway at speed. If you tow heavy the motor runs at a higher operating temp and regen cycles are less frequent.

Dodges in particular are know to "make oil" i.e., the engine oil level goes up in between oil changes because diesel in jected into the exhaust stroke during regen blows by the piston. This contaminates the oil with diesel and the engine oil has a very distinct diesel odor. I have personally experienced this. DPF's may be able to be cleaned with a spray foam but require removal.

This is why so many folks "delete" the DPF and use aftermarket ECM's to fool the motor into never going through regen.

If that does not sound bad enough, EGR takes exhaust gas and mixes it with incoming fresh air and uses it for combustion. The EGR is typially a metal tube that goes from the exhaust side of the engine to the intake after the intercooler. (Ford's 6.0 Powerstroke in the mid-2000's had/has a very fauly EGR cooler design and was a source - among other issues - for the motor's poor reliability reputation) The EGR path gets clogged with soot and it basically creates a big mess on the intake side of the motor. This along is thought to seriously reduce the useful life of modern diesel's.

Urea is fine other than you have to buy it and add it. Some believe that is is corrosive to the exhaust system. Most OEM's put the urea filler next to the diesel filler and folks will occasionally mistakenly add it to the diesel tank. That will be $14k for a new motor please.

All these collectively reduce soot, SOX and NOX. The trade, poor mileage and more fuel burned, more cost to the consumer, much shorter useful life, higher repair bills and oh yeah, MORE CO2 because of the poor fuel economy. You government at work, folks.

 

[tempforce]

i bought my B3350 hsdc in january this year. it's now mid july. my tractor has been worked on 11 times for the emissions junk.. and 1 time for an oil leak due to an improper repair. (system was apart, to install a new wiring harness and alternator.).. my dealership was sold during this time, the new dealership is really trying to resolve the problem.
today they received a stop work order from kubota... the service manager told me that he will know monday what kubota is planning on doing about the defective engine emission controls on my tractor. he is pushing for a replacement tractor... if kubota decides to trade, i'm down sizing to the B2650 hsdc.

 

[Tooljunkie]

Mr Scott's view of diesel emissions is pretty close i think.
What i dont understand is the Mega Tons of emissions dumped into our atmosphere by the 20 or so jet planes flying over our heads each and every minute of the day.

By making vehicles more fuel efficient,dependable and recycleable do we not in turn make them more environmentally friendly?
The technology compared to the 80's is vastly greater, so why do wheel bearings fail in 60,000 kilometeres yet my 80 power wagon used and abused (snow plow) has 460,000 and to my knowledge still original bearings at all 4 corners. It has about 10 lbs of plastic in it (if that) and all the rest is recycleable.
I still think all this technology is moving us backwards environmentally.

Its great kubota is finally admitting there is a serious enough problem to stop work on your machine, but it still doesent make up for all your downtime.
Perhaps along with downsizing you can option -up the smaller machine for all the hardship it has caused you.
I hope it ends up where somehow you benefit from all this stress.
Good luck.

 

[bumper]

.. if kubota decides to trade, i'm down sizing to the B2650 hsdc.

Please post back and let us know how this turns out.

So far, I've only had my B3350 back for three programming updates IIRC. It has 360 hours, purchased 11/13, one of the early ones. I use it mostly for snowblowing, mowing etc. The DPF is a pain to live with, as you end up running the tractor at higher rpms than the job needs, and don't let it idle for too long.

I bought the B3350 as I live at 4800 feet and wanted the extra power lost through normal aspiration on the B2650. If I had it to do over, I probably would go with the 2650 as well.

 

[tempforce]

i wish there was a turbo kit for the B2650. i would be putting it on, as soon as the warranty was out...

 

[speedyvelo]

I have the same experience that all of you. Kubota B3350 with DPF problem since day one. I use it mainly for snow removal. I live at 9000 F of altitude. When the tractor works is great but.. and despite 4 times into the dealer shop and 3 upgrades directed by Kubota the problem persists. Yes I follow all the advices: high rpm's no idling etc. Periodically the tractor stop, I can not restart it and I have to wait many hours, then starts again. During the summer this is not a a major issue, but during the snow season is key, we depend on the snow removal to get out of the house and our driveway is 0.75 miles long. I have only 100 hours in this B3350. After discussing this problem over and over with the dealer, I decided to get a new tractor which should be here in a couple of weeks (L6060). The dealer credit me almost the same amount a paid initially for the B3350 so I can not complain. Of course I was not expecting to have to spend this amount of money for my needs but.. it is done and hope the Kubota L6060 behaves a touch better ;-)

 

[tempforce]

i have about 35 hours on my B2650 hsdc. noticeably less power. no emission junk hung on the exterior of the engine. no computer. it could use a turbo for a bit more power. over all, it will get the job done, only slower.
kubota gave me what the purchase price of my B3350hsdc cost me, minus my payments. i got screwed on that. plus the B2650 is now the price i paid for my B3350. so no difference in price. also the B2650 does not have the 0% interest. so now my payments will be higher. if this tractor doesn't last me the rest of my life. i will buy a different brand next time..

 

[speedyvelo]

i have about 35 hours on my B2650 hsdc if this tractor doesn't last me the rest of my life. i will buy a different brand next time..

One of my neighbors has your tractor and it works great and it is very dependable. Kubota makes excellent tractors, the problem with the B3350 is another collateral damage produced by the EPA.

 

[Myb3350]

I have a B3350 SO FAR it is perfect, love the tractor, but were theirs smoke their is fire, lots of smoke coming from the B3350 owners, I blame the EPA and koubta co. If Kubota will screw up on the B3350 then they will do the same thing on anything they make, Kubota need to address the B3350 problem and stand behind the tractor 100% so far my B3350 is perfect but if I start having DPF and REGEN problems I will be very disappointed with Kubota, I have called the kubota service rep twice and he has not return my call, no excuse for that.

 

[drsii]

Hi Everyone,

TL;DR: My 3350su has been great but have experienced the issues discussed at length in this thread as well. Dealer is replacing the thermostat and doing two required updates from Kubota on the issue. Will keep this updated.

Bought my Kubota 3350SU early spring. It was a trade in from a previous owner experiencing the exact same issues. At the time the dealer told me the issue was operator error but a few weeks I found this thread and simply crossed my fingers.

Tractor has been a Great workhorse. It's handled just about everything I've thrown at it. I've been very pleased and during the summer went into Regen mode twice in about 40 hours use. Both took about 30 minutes to complete but otherwise no issues. Annoying for sure.

Last week after the first snow the tractor went into Regen mode again. Couldn't of been more then 10 hours since the last one. It took about 45 minutes to complete.

Afterwards anytime I start the tractor it beeps and wants to regen but will never complete. Today the dealer said there was a thermostat issue and it would need to be replaced but acknowledged there have been two updates from the dealer on the issue. I'm hopeful that is the case.

- Dan

 

[sheepfarmer]

Drsii, have you been able to do a parked regen successfully? I am generally curious about why the 3350 can't successfully regen sometimes, and the L series tractors generally can. It is a different engine, different dpf system and so forth. I have a 2650 and the operators manual has the directions for the B 3350 too, and they are really different from those for the L3560. They make the comment if the regen interval on the 3350 gets shorter than 4 hrs to do a parked regen which struck me as odd. What do you suppose is different about a parked regen versus an auto regen?