T1400H. Changed fluids, now it runs like bleh.

[MdPhoenix]

Greetings all. It saddens me that my first post is a cry for help. But I promise to stick around and share all I've learned with those in need after me.

I have a T1400H. I received it free two years ago. Long story on that. Some other time.

I've been using it for a year - it sat for a year and that's another long story.

The gentleman who gave it to me used it once a year to clean up the leaves in his yard. I'm very fortunate to have a mower in such good condition.

On to the issues.

Today, I decided I was going to change out the fluids. Oil, diff, and hydro.

I replaced all oils with synthetic.

The motor oil - no sweat.

The gear oil in the diff - I only had one quart of 75-90 and one quart of 140. So I put in all of the 75-90 and the rest (it takes 1.6) was 140 weight. Interestingly, it took the entire two quarts.

The hydro - I put in synthetic as well. 10w-30 as the manual calls for. I drained as much as I could with a hand pump. Pulled the filter and cleaned it, then put it all back together and filled it up.

I ran it for a few minutes on a jack and ran the trans back and forth. It sounded horrible and I thought it needed to work it's way in.

Then I took it for a ride. On acceleration, it vibrates, a lot.
Previously, when I let off the pedal, it would come to an abrupt stop. Now it coasts a few feet to a stop. It seems to run well when up to speed, but something just isn't right. Before it was a little noisy in the rear end (tended to groan a bit when accelerating) but it was strong and reliable. I fear that putting new fluid has ruined my beloved tractor. Is there any hope? Did the synthetic do her in? The incorrect and mixing of weights in the diff?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Eric McCarthy]

When you did the filters did you clean out the suction screen? Could have some gunk in the screen and things arent flowing right.

 

[MdPhoenix]

When you did the filters did you clean out the suction screen? Could have some gunk in the screen and things arent flowing right.

Thanks for the quick reply!

I didn't see a screen. Of course there was a bit of fluid in the bottom of the filter slot. I pulled an allen screw, on top of that was a steel disc. Under that was the filter. A strange material. It was a cyndrilical tube. I didn't notice if anything was under it.

Do you think the gear oil discrepancy could be causing this?

 

[Eric McCarthy]

Take a look at the fluid specs from the Kubota website, it could be from the mixed coctail in the gear oil.

http://www.kubota.com/part/PartsLookup.aspx

 

[MdPhoenix]

Take a look at the fluid specs from the Kubota website, it could be from the mixed coctail in the gear oil.

http://www.kubota.com/part/PartsLookup.aspx

I'll pull what I put in and change it over to straight 90 as per the manual.

Is synthetic okay for an older vehicle?

 

[Eric McCarthy]

Sure I dont see why not.

 

[Bulldog]

I think synthetic lubricants are the only way to go. That being said you listed that you used 10w30 in the hydro. Was it motor oil or what. I'll give you a example of what I ran into years ago.

I had a 93 model Honda CR 250 dirt bike. You could run petrolium 10w30 motor oil in the tranny without any issue. I could use Honda's synthetic 75w90 gear oil and everything was fine. I tried using Mobil 1 10w30 and the clutch slipped so bad it just barely would pull. My point being whether using synthetic or petrolium lubricants, make sure you have the correct fluid for the intended application. In a wet clutch system a fluid with the wrong additives will cause nothing but problems.

 

[kc8fbl]

I think synthetic lubricants are the only way to go. That being said you listed that you used 10w30 in the hydro. Was it motor oil or what. I'll give you a example of what I ran into years ago.

I had a 93 model Honda CR 250 dirt bike. You could run petrolium 10w30 motor oil in the tranny without any issue. I could use Honda's synthetic 75w90 gear oil and everything was fine. I tried using Mobil 1 10w30 and the clutch slipped so bad it just barely would pull. My point being whether using synthetic or petrolium lubricants, make sure you have the correct fluid for the intended application. In a wet clutch system a fluid with the wrong additives will cause nothing but problems.

That's exactly the same thing I was thinking. I'm guessing this could be the reason your tractor coasted to a stop instead of the abrupt stop like before.

 

[MdPhoenix]

From the manual:
Hydrostatic Transmission 0.60 US qts. (0.57 L) API service CD SAE 10w-30

Transmission Case - T1400H 1.9 US qts. (1.8 L)
- T1400 2.7 US qts. (2.6 L)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Multi-grade trasnmission fluid or gear oil SAE #90. The fluid listed below or equivelent are recommended.
Kubota - UDT Hydrostatic transmission fluid
Shell - Donax-TD Donax-TM
Mobil - Mobil Fluid 350, 423
Exxon - Torque Fluid 56

Confusing, is it not? So I have the top end, which I believe is the Hydrostatic Portion, which had oil that looked and smelled like engine oil. It has a top off canister at the top with level markings. This is the unit which had the filter in it which I also removed and cleaned carefully as I read it may not be made any more. I put back Synthetic 10w-30 in this.

The bottom, which to me, is a differential, although it looks like they're referring to it as a Transmission had gear oil in it. I replaced it with my concoction of gear oil.

I'm confused as hell. The bottom definitely had Gear oil. The top could have been something else, like aft or something, but at this point, I'm really not sure. That's why I went with the motor oil as SAE 10w-30 to me was regular engine oil.


EDIT: Reading up on oil types, it appears that CD oil is for diesel engines. I bought Mobil 1 10w-30. I'll see if it has a CD rating.

 

[Bulldog]

It sounds like you need tractor trans/hyd fluid instead of engine oil. I can say this for sure that Mobil 1 oil can not be used in a wet clutch system. It has a additive package that does not allow it.

This info is from my on personal experience, from Honda and from Mobil oil corporation tech department.

You can get synthetic trans/hyd fluid if you want it. That's what I run in my Kubotas and have been since they were new.

 

[MdPhoenix]

It sounds like you need tractor trans/hyd fluid instead of engine oil. I can say this for sure that Mobil 1 oil can not be used in a wet clutch system. It has a additive package that does not allow it.

This info is from my on personal experience, from Honda and from Mobil oil corporation tech department.

You can get synthetic trans/hyd fluid if you want it. That's what I run in my Kubotas and have been since they were new.

Outstanding information. Could you tell me what brand/type to get? I asked my local auto parts dealer and they didn't have a clue. Just an idea of what to look for? I'm headed out soon and wanted to try to get something today.

Thanks!

 

[MdPhoenix]

Just picked up two gallons of udt compatible fluid from Tractor Supply. We'll see how it fares.

Sent from mobile command...

 

[Bulldog]

Sorry it took so long to get back to you, I've been in the hay field all afternoon. I personally use Amsoil synthetic lubricants in everything I own except my bobcat. It has a few leaks and I can't see letting $40 a gallon fluid leak out on the ground. I know it's 5x higher than the TSC fluid but the difference is amazing. To me a few dollars spent on PM is a lot cheaper than repairing or replacing a tractor.

 

[MdPhoenix]

I was looking for it but couldn't find it locally. It's all I use in my truck. I'm going to see if this fixes my problem. If so, I'll order some from my Amsoil Rep.

Thanks again!


Sent from mobile command...

 

[Bulldog]

I have a feeling it will straighten your problem out.

 

[MdPhoenix]

I wanted to update everyone on this.

I emptied the motor oil from the hydro by pumping it out of the fill reservoir and pulling the filter then pumping it out of there. I put in fresh hydro oil. Ran it for a while up in the air to let all of the motor oil mix with the hydro oil. Pumped that out, then put in another round of fresh fluid. Ran it again up in the air to get the air out of the system. Took it out for a ride. It was a little ugly at first. It groaned and vibrated on takeoff. It drifted to a stop instead of an abrupt stop. I read somewhere that running it downhill, then holding in the transmission release lever and letting off the pedal helps it get the air out. So I did so. It ran much better after doing this several times. However it still seems to have issues when first moving after sitting for a while. I assume there's still air in the system? Maybe it'll all just work itself out?

 

[MagKarl]

i doubt it's air. Your clutch has been soaked in motor oil that is going to take a while to clean itself of.

 

[MdPhoenix]

Good enough for me. We'll see how it does over the next few weeks. Just about time to park it and put the plow on the Craftsman for the winter!

 

[Stubbyie]

Double-check the hydrostatic transmission oil specs.

Would not surprise me to find you are correct to use "engine oil".

My spouse's big Hustler mower uses a specific grade/type (won't be specific to prevent confusion in this thread) ENGINE or MOTOR oil as its hydrostatic hydraulic fluid.

Stay strictly with the specified fluids in all cases. I don't think any modern hydrostatic drive system is going to appreciate a mix of different fluids.

 

[beedabee1]

Hi,

I am new here. I have a Kubota T1400 riding mower. The issue I am running into is the Speed Control Pedal (You press down to move foward, or press backward or up to go in reverse) is stuck in the down or forward position. I have looked be cannot see anything that looks like it is blocking this pedal from going back to neutral. Any suggestions? Is this ran on Hydraulics? As you can tell I know little about this mower, and am trying to fix it up to use. Any information would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks