4530 Backhoe swing cylinder removal problem

[ole blue moon]

Hello to all and thanks for any help with my problem. I need to remove the swing cylinder from a 4530B backhoe in order to replace the seals. The chrome rod that passes through the cylinder is bolted to the frame on both right and left side. The right side has a flat spot at the end of the chrome rod that allows a wrench to stop the rotation of the rod to undo the bolt. So far good as I got the bolt loose OK.

Problem is the left bolt...there is no flat spot on the chrome rod to hold with a wrench. I thought the rod was one piece and put the wrench on the other side of the rod which has the flat spot, but then the left part of the rod turns even though the right side does not. Tried using a vice grip not on the chrome but there is a small part at the end not chromed. This did not work since it slipped. Since the rods turn independently seems to mean either the rod is in two pieces by design or it is sheared/broken. From what I see in the parts diagram in the manual looks like one rod all the way through but I could be wrong.

Anyway this is a confusing thing to me and wonder if anyone has done this and can help with removing that bolt. Thanks again for any info.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

One thought is the threads on the other side are reversed, try tightening it and see if it comes loose.
Also try an impact that will spin the bolt out faster than the rod can turn.

The shaft has a piston in the middle if there is any end to end play then it sounds like something is broken in there.

 

[MagKarl]

I'm surprised it isn't one rod running through, but maybe it's easier to build it that way. Maybe each side shaft is threaded into the piston? I have a manual and it shows the rod(s) and piston all as one component.

Unfortunately it doesn't say how to get the cylinder out of the backhoe. If only one of the shafts has a flat for a wrench, I think maybe you have to loosen them in the right order. Try snugging the right side back up tight and then try to loosen the left.

My backhoe is similar, I'll try to look at it tomorrow to see if any helpful ideas come up.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

I would try and turn the shaft on the cylinder and see if it will lock up if you run it the opposite of the bolt removal direction, if it does then I would bet on it having a left hand threaded bolt in the other end.
If the cylinder will not quit spinning then I'm betting the shaft is broken, you can take a chunk of rubber and a 2x4 and use it to keep the shaft from turning to remove the bolt.
Again I would use an impact to spin the bolt off.

Here is a little more research on it.
Swing cylinder is P/N 70020-01220 $895.07

Rod is P/N 70030-01326 $659.97

 

[kubotasam]

Have you tries a pneumatic impact wrench? Many times they will spin bolt out without needing to hold it on the other end.

 

[kubotasam]

I just went and looked at my backhoe. Mine is a Woods BH750 which is the same as your Kubota. Mine also only has the flat spot on one end. I looked in my manual. It lists the bolts for the ends as 3/4" x 1 1/2" NC bolt-- grade 5. No mention of a left handed thread bolt for one side. I am wondering if there would be clearance enough to remove the cylinder if you ground the head off the bolt on that side.

 

[Dan_R_42]

ole blue moon, Welcome to OTT...

Very interesting topic. Following along and learning as I go for this model. Any chance of posting some photos for those without access to this model, so we can follow along?

Thanks, Dan

 

[ole blue moon]

Thanks for all the responses. I went to the dealer to try to verify if one side was left hand thread. The bolts don't show up on the exploded diagram. The parts person said it would not be left hand and that if only one side is turning it is probably a broken rod. I clamped the vice grip on the rod so tight my hands hurt then heated up the bolt and rod and success, it came off.

As to the rod, Magkarl was right, I didn't notice that the rod and puck are shown as one part. The two sections of the rod are either press fit or threaded together with the puck in between and the threads are hidden behind the puck. The puck of course is stationary fixed to the rod at the center. Luckily the rod is not broken but is turning at the point shown on the photo. There is a small chamfer on the rod at the joint which looks like threads but is not. If it is threaded will have to be sure it is tight before reassembly.

Thanks again to all, will get the seal kit next week and reassemble.

 

[kubotasam]

I am glad you got it apart. It is certainly a learning experience for all of us. I will make a note in my backhoe manual that it is possible for the two sides to separate.

 

[ole blue moon]

Kubotasam,

Thanks for the note. I might have given the wrong impression. The two sides of the rod are not designed to come apart or turn separately. It only turned separately with considerable force on the left side bolt with a socket drive. It is good to aware of this in case it occurs. If I had it to do again I would try to remove the left side first while holding onto the right side flat with a thin end wrench.

This is the third cylinder I have rebuilt and the only one that caused any problems. BTW these were all the E or Energy type not the L.

Thanks

 

[Dan_R_42]

Ah, that looks similar to the Woods style backhoes. It uses a chain as a part of the side to side swivel. I have heard a lot of complaints regarding breakdowns with that design with the chain.

When I was looking at backhoes back in the mid 1980's for my 7100 that is what drove to the ARPS backhoes. They use two pistons for side to side travel.

 

[kubotasam]

Now that your backhoe is all apart if you would like to replace the bearing that the kingpost swings on I have a brand new one for sale in the classified section of OTT. When I rebuilt my hoe I got an ebay deal on 3 of them so I have one new extra.

 

[DMC]

I know that this is an old thread.

I found this discussion when trying to figure out how to remove the swing cylinder on my BL4690 Backhoe attachment. I believe that this cylinder is made so that when you turn one side or the other that the entire assembly will either extend or shrink. I think it is designed this way for solid positioning in the intended position, and to facilitate removal.

I finally had to re tighten the left side and then turn the right side of the cylinder on the provided spot to get a purchase with channel locks. Once I removed the mounting bolt, I was able to get enough room for the right side of the cylinder to drop down. Then I still had to struggle with the left side which would be easier to deal with if there were a convenient place to get a wrench on that side as well. My solution was vice grips and a heavy leather glove. Initially the cylinder slipped until it turned a few revolutions, but once friction built up the leather and the vice grips held the cylinder thus enabling the removal of the mounting bolt. Then I was able to manipulate the cylinder assembly from the backhoe attachment.

I hope that this will help someone else when trying to remove this particular swing cylinder. For the record knowing what I know now, I would much rather have two swing cylinders like on the BT90. This is a bad design IMHO.