Too fat/lazy/old to unlock your SSQA?????……..Then follow me ;)

[Runs With Scissors]

OK, as the title suggests; "The Laziest man south of the Mackinac Bridge" is fed up with taking the 45 seconds it takes to get off the machine, flip 2 levers, then get back on the machine, jockey around with the loader, then get back off the machine, flip the 2 levers again, and then remount said “machine”.

Much for the same reason I take “elevators", instead of “stairs", I have decided that life is too short to “work that hard”; Hence the mod.

Now most of my “project posts" are “post-project” posts,…….. Meaning that I am too embarrassed to publicly start a project, then “get squirreled”, and never complete it/them publicly. (although exceptions do exist )


The basic problem(s) is/was my “piss-poor” attention span, work, and money.

I have recently eliminated one of the three problems.



Another problem is my lack of “more advanced” hydraulic knowledge.


I understand the very basics of hydraulics from my time as an A&P and Auto mechanic, however it has been a long time since either one of those was a profession for me. I can read simple schematics, know SOME nomenclature, so it’s not “day one of Kindergarten” for me, but…...

Well anywhoo, one of the reasons that I have not started this particular project has been my lack of a “Plan”. I do not want to order a “shit load” of parts without being confident they work together.

So I hoping for some guidance, so I can be confident I am buying the correct parts, in order to avoid costly mistakes.

Here are 2 of my “home-made” schematics that I posted in the other thread.

see here


As I reflect on my first one…..the problem I see, is that with “T’s” you end up actuating both the original set of couplers and the new cylinder at the same time.

OK…I get that.



My “second go at it" eliminates the “T’s” .

So, I think it is a viable option …..






My second attempt eliminates the “dual actuation” problem…I think.

I was looking at an “open center diverter valve” maybe like this one.



13 GPM 12 Volt DC SAE 8 Solenoid Operated Double Selector Valve Dynamic DSV-62-08-12


The above would have a “schematic” kind of like my second “beautiful drawing” in my head.






Here are some pics of what my tractor looks like now…..

Here is what I would call the “main control valve"



Same valve housing (different angle)




Here is what I call(ed) a "3rd function valve", for my grapple………..BUT upon further reading, I think this is actually called a “diverter valve” but I’m still not sure about that?




Lastly, here is a pic of what I believe is the “main hydraulic supply block”





Here is an “overall” shot of it.





Thoughts?

Pros/Cons?

Suggestions?

 

[Firefight100]

use an electric linear actuator instead of hydraulics. Easier and cheaper

 

[Runs With Scissors]

use an electric linear actuator instead of hydraulics. Easier and cheaper

I thought about that, but I am impressed with the speed and “beefy’ness” of the hydraulic version.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Your third function looks like a true third function and not a diverter.

How you know which you have:
A diverter will make it swap between 2 functions, Like roll and grapple, where you can only run one or the other.
A true third function is where you can operate roll, lift, and third function all at the same time.

 

[Russell King]

I suggest you read the label on your unknown valve and look up the model number. Then you will know exactly what you have. There is also a hydraulic schematic on it that shows its operation but I can’t see it clearly and probably wouldn’t understand it anyway!

Then I also suggest that you use a separate valve to control the SSQA locks so you don’t accidentally unlock them. That is not much more cost than a diverter if at all. I have no idea where you would mount it but I think an electrically controlled valve might be the best for this. I generally prefer manual valves for the ability to feather them instead of 100% on when operated.

I don’t know if you could damage anything on the lock if it wasn’t aligned properly when you activated the electrical valve, so consider that before buying.

One other thought is to use your existing electrical valve for the lock and use a new manual valve to control the grapple lid to give more control.

You could also add rear remote valves to your tractor and use one of those, but that might be ”not very elegant”.

And just because you have a CNC plasma cutter, I expect to see some very elegant levers and brackets on this! Curves are cooler than straight lines!

 

[Old Machinist]

I see no reason your design won't work. If I read it right you want to add a diverter valve on the output lines of the 3rd function. So when you supply 12V to the diverter and activate the 3rd function it will instead send the hydraulic flow to the quick hitch latching/unlatching cylinder. When you take away the 12V to the diverter the open center ports will allow the 3rd function to work as it always did.

 

[Runs With Scissors]

I see no reason your design won't work. If I read it right you want to add a diverter valve on the output lines of the 3rd function. So when you supply 12V to the diverter and activate the 3rd function it will instead send the hydraulic flow to the quick hitch latching/unlatching cylinder. When you take away the 12V to the diverter the open center ports will allow the 3rd function to work as it always did.

Yes sir!

That is exactly how I am picturing it in my head.

 

[Runs With Scissors]

And just because you have a CNC plasma cutter, I expect to see some very elegant levers and brackets on this! Curves are cooler than straight lines!

I absolutely planned on that!!!

I will probably incorporate some handles like the originals for a “manual override” feature as well.

 

[Runs With Scissors]

Your third function looks like a true third function and not a diverter.

How you know which you have:
A diverter will make it swap between 2 functions, Like roll and grapple, where you can only run one or the other.
A true third function is where you can operate roll, lift, and third function all at the same time.

Thanks, I will have to try this today.

Oddly enough, I have never thought about it before now.

 

[Runs With Scissors]

Any ideas on the best places to price out custom hoses?

I will search locally, but I would like to have some sort of “baseline” to compare.

 

[Old Machinist]

Any ideas on the best places to price out custom hoses?

I will search locally, but I would like to have some sort of “baseline” to compare.

You can get online prices for custom hoses at https://www.discounthydraulichose.com/. I bought all the fittings and hoses for my DIY 3rd function from them

 

[TheOldHokie]

OK, as the title suggests; "The Laziest man south of the Mackinac Bridge" is fed up with taking the 45 seconds it takes to get off the machine, flip 2 levers, then get back on the machine, jockey around with the loader, then get back off the machine, flip the 2 levers again, and then remount said “machine”.

Much for the same reason I take “elevators", instead of “stairs", I have decided that life is too short to “work that hard”; Hence the mod.

Now most of my “project posts" are “post-project” posts,…….. Meaning that I am too embarrassed to publicly start a project, then “get squirreled”, and never complete it/them publicly. (although exceptions do exist )


The basic problem(s) is/was my “piss-poor” attention span, work, and money.

I have recently eliminated one of the three problems.



Another problem is my lack of “more advanced” hydraulic knowledge.


I understand the very basics of hydraulics from my time as an A&P and Auto mechanic, however it has been a long time since either one of those was a profession for me. I can read simple schematics, know SOME nomenclature, so it’s not “day one of Kindergarten” for me, but…...

Well anywhoo, one of the reasons that I have not started this particular project has been my lack of a “Plan”. I do not want to order a “shit load” of parts without being confident they work together.

So I hoping for some guidance, so I can be confident I am buying the correct parts, in order to avoid costly mistakes.

Here are 2 of my “home-made” schematics that I posted in the other thread.

see here


As I reflect on my first one…..the problem I see, is that with “T’s” you end up actuating both the original set of couplers and the new cylinder at the same time.

OK…I get that.
View attachment 176782


My “second go at it" eliminates the “T’s” .

So, I think it is a viable option …..



View attachment 176783


My second attempt eliminates the “dual actuation” problem…I think.

I was looking at an “open center diverter valve” maybe like this one.


View attachment 176784
13 GPM 12 Volt DC SAE 8 Solenoid Operated Double Selector Valve Dynamic DSV-62-08-12


The above would have a “schematic” kind of like my second “beautiful drawing” in my head.






Here are some pics of what my tractor looks like now…..

Here is what I would call the “main control valve"

View attachment 176785

Same valve housing (different angle)

View attachment 176786


Here is what I call(ed) a "3rd function valve", for my grapple………..BUT upon further reading, I think this is actually called a “diverter valve” but I’m still not sure about that?
View attachment 176787



Lastly, here is a pic of what I believe is the “main hydraulic supply block”

View attachment 176788



Here is an “overall” shot of it.

View attachment 176789



Thoughts?

Pros/Cons?

Suggestions?

A diverter is just another name for a selector valve. In this case your diverter is a " 6 way" selector valve. It as two inlets and 4 outlets.



When in "neutral" (unpowered) it connects the inlets to two of the 4 outlets and the other two are blocked.

When shifted (energized) the inlets are switched to the other set of outlets and the first set are blocked.

This allows you to use one directional control valve for two different functions BUT the functions supplied by the outlets are mutually exclusive. You can only use one at a time. Simple as that.

Your loader has a true dircectional control valve for third function. It operates (more or less) independent of the loader valve and in theory allows you to operate bucket, boom, and grapple simultaneosly. In real life thats not quite true.



Dan

 

[hedgerow]

Any ideas on the best places to price out custom hoses?

I will search locally, but I would like to have some sort of “baseline” to compare.

Take a look a Surplus Center in Lincoln Nebraska. I buy a lot of hyd hoses and fitting from them. Prices seem good.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Take a look a Surplus Center in Lincoln Nebraska. I buy a lot of hyd hoses and fitting from them. Prices seem good.

For a single hose Surplus Center is as cheap as it gets. They charge the actual cost of the fittings and hose plus $10 assembly fee. However I am not a fan of their hose.

Dan

 

[Workerbee]

Nice work RWS! I was curious though, which of your three problems did you eliminate? Im guessing the money? Mine seems to disappear too….

 

[Donystoy]

For a single hose Surplus Center is as cheap as it gets. They charge the actual cost of the fittings and hose plus $10 assembly fee. However I am not a fan of their hose.

Dan

Not sure if Harbor Freight makes hoses but Princess Auto up here does. Decent price but when I built my log splitter many moons ago I opted for good quality hoses at a hydraulic supply house since I am standing beside them while operating the splitter. Still like new but other cheaper hoses quickly crack on the outside rubber even if stored in a dark location.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Not sure if Harbor Freight makes hoses but Princess Auto up here does. Decent price but when I built my log splitter many moons ago I opted for good quality hoses at a hydraulic supply house since I am standing beside them while operating the splitter. Still like new but other cheaper hoses quickly crack on the outside rubber even if stored in a dark location.

Let me clarify my previous post. First I confused Surplus Center and Discount Hydrailic Hose.

As far as I know Surplus Center does not sell custom hoses online - they sell premade NRP Jones hose assemblies with JIC female swivel or male NPT ends. They may may well make custom hoses for walk in customers.

Discount Hydraulic Hose sells bulk hose and end fittings. They also sell made to order custom hose assemblies online.

I have used hundreds of the NRP Jones hoses from Surplus Center and they are perfectly fine quality.

I have purchased hundreds of feet of bulk hose and end fittings from Discount Hydraulic hose and it is also perfectly fine hose.

Both sources supply commodity R1, R2, and R16 hose like you would get at a tractor supply. I have bever had an issue with those hoses failing or deteriorating . In no way are they unsafe.

But there are more expensive sources for higher performace hose. In particular I sm talking about more flexible hose with smaller bend radius. I am now making my own hose assemblies and my go to hose is Gates MegaSys MXT. Its roughly twice the cost of commodity R16 hose but I think well worth the added expense. Parker will be happy to sell you much more expensive hose.

If you need/want custom ends and can't make your own hose assemblies Discount Hydraulic Hose is a great source of supply.



Dan

 

[Runs With Scissors]

Let me clarify my previous post. First I confused Surplus Center and Discount Hydrailic Hose.

As far as I know Surplus Center does not sell custom hoses online - they sell premade NRP Jones hose assemblies with JIC female swivel or male NPT ends. They may may well make custom hoses for walk in customers.

Discount Hydraulic Hose sells bulk hose and end fittings. They also sell made to order custom hose assemblies online.

I have used hundreds of the NRP Jones hoses from Surplus Center and they are perfectly fine quality.

I have purchased hundreds of feet of bulk hose and end fittings from Discount Hydraulic hose and it is also perfectly fine hose.

Both sources supply commodity R1, R2, and R16 hose like you would get at a tractor supply. I have bever had an issue with those hoses failing or deteriorating . In no way are they unsafe.

But there are more expensive sources for higher performace hose. In particular I sm talking about more flexible hose with smaller bend radius. I am now making my own hose assemblies and my go to hose is Gates MegaSys MXT. Its roughly twice the cost of commodity R16 hose but I think well worth the added expense. Parker will be happy to sell you much more expensive hose.

If you need/want custom ends and can't make your own hose assemblies Discount Hydraulic Hose is a great source of supply.

View attachment 176845

Dan

Thanks Dan, I will look them up and give them a whirl.


I am going to start taking measurement today to get this “ball rolling”.

Any suggestions on hose size? (diameter)…………. I don’t think I will need hoses as big as the ones going to the grapple connections, but ?????

Also, when you give them the "length of hose” measurement, will/does that include the fittings, or is it the actual cut length of the hose and you have to factor in the length of the fittings?

 

[TheOldHokie]

Thanks Dan, I will look them up and give them a whirl.


I am going to start taking measurement today to get this “ball rolling”.

Any suggestions on hose size? (diameter)…………. I don’t think I will need hoses as big as the ones going to the grapple connections, but ?????

Also, when you give them the "length of hose” measurement, will/does that include the fittings, or is it the actual cut length of the hose and you have to factor in the length of the fittings?

DHH has a guide on how to measure lengths and clock fittings

Made to Order Hydraulic Hose Assemblies | Discount Hydraulic Hose

Shop Discount Hydraulic Hose Made to order Hydraulic Assemblies Online. Create Custom Hydraulic Hose Assemblies Online that ship right to your door.

www.discounthydraulichose.com

1/4" hose is more than adequate. I suggest their standard R16 hose. They promote their HT hose (also R16) but personally its a waste of money. Whatever you chose get hoses with JIC-06 female swivel ends.

Are you doing a diverter or directional valve? You need to buy and mount it before you can measure hose runs.

Dan

 

[Kennyd4110]

If you know the fittings needed, we can also do custom hose assemblies in 1/4 or 3/8.

1/4" is all you need.

Here is how hoses are measured: