L2201 Nasty Fuel Tank, stalling issues, has anyone gone to aluminum?

[jwarrenjr]

Hello everyone! I'm new here, new to tractors, Kubotas, and diesel engines for that matter. I bought this L2201 for probably a bit too much, but it was in my price range. It was running rough, but it was running so all the positive signs were there that I was going to get emotionally involved. I replaced the fuel pump, 1 leaky injector tube (new injectors on the way), adjusted the valves, changed the oil, drained all fuel & partially re-filled, and changed the fuel filter...That thing runs like any diesel I've ever heard! I am SUPER excited about this tractor!!!

So after all that, I pulled it off the trailer, parked the trailer with my rusting new to me running like new tractor, and when I went to park the tractor it just died. I'll save you the long story of starting it, it stalling, and trying to make due to get it where I wanted, failed...it's still sitting in the middle of my clearing.

I've research a couple things. I know the bottom of the tank looks like vomit, so yes the fuel filter is probably clogged. It could possibly be the petcock (motorcycle term) IF it has the upright in-tank filter screen like a motorcycle. I had a motorcycle a while back that the last 1/4" of the tank couldn't be used because so much rust was piled up around it. Top the tank off and you would never know. I have not tested this theory with the tractor yet. Either way it leads to that tank vomit.

Me personally, I don't really have the time to reseal the tank. I have learned about the prices of replacing it, even with a used tank in a better condition tank that I'd ALSO have to reseal. (CRAZY!!) So some racing fuel cells are actually far cheaper than even replacing the petcock (I can't confirm the proper nomenclature for the tractor). The other thing, I've resealed a tank before and of all the things I'm good at....that is not one! I'm looking to eliminate the fuel rust issue and be done with this problem to the best of my abilities. Even if I have to get a smaller fuel cell so that it will fit. So far all the tanks I THINK fit my L2201, there is a hole that goes through the tank (is it for the steering shaft or wiring??) so I more than likely would have to lose some capacity to go this route.

Has anyone else done this?

 

[Russell King]

You can probably get the tractor running by blowing back into the tank through the fuel line into the filter housing.

See this thread for my story on a similar L185 fuel tank problem.

Rusted fuel tank repair

A few weeks ago I had trouble with my L185 acting like it was running out of fuel. Added fuel tried to start= no go! Took off fuel line into filter and no fuel came out of line. Blew air into line and it cleared blockage so I got it running. A couple weeks go by and same deal. I take tank...

www.orangetractortalks.com

You can probably rig up some tank in place of the steel tank. The problem with that is the tank does give some support to the steering column. The steering column does come up through the hole in the tank and there is a bushing that gets shoved between the tank and the column. Yours I’d probably missing but I suggest you get it replaced sooner than later otherwise you can break the steering box.

I suppose you can design an alternate support for the column and an alternate tank.

 

[jwarrenjr]

You can probably get the tractor running by blowing back into the tank through the fuel line into the filter housing.

See this thread for my story on a similar L185 fuel tank problem.

Rusted fuel tank repair

A few weeks ago I had trouble with my L185 acting like it was running out of fuel. Added fuel tried to start= no go! Took off fuel line into filter and no fuel came out of line. Blew air into line and it cleared blockage so I got it running. A couple weeks go by and same deal. I take tank...

www.orangetractortalks.com

You can probably rig up some tank in place of the steel tank. The problem with that is the tank does give some support to the steering column. The steering column does come up through the hole in the tank and there is a bushing that gets shoved between the tank and the column. Yours I’d probably missing but I suggest you get it replaced sooner than later otherwise you can break the steering box.

I suppose you can design an alternate support for the column and an alternate tank.

OK! the Caswell being a 2 part epoxy I'll be willing to give that a try. Years ago I did red-koat....DO NOT do red-koat. I actually did it twice, once on a '82 850 suzuki and once on a '85 goldwing. both times red stuff made it into the carbs and required pretty much carb replacement. They would just stick.

I'm trying to look up info on it now. I know I want to get as much crud out as I can, but do I need clean metal with this product or just get rid of loose stuff and flakes?

 

[Russell King]

OK! the Caswell being a 2 part epoxy I'll be willing to give that a try. Years ago I did red-koat....DO NOT do red-koat. I actually did it twice, once on a '82 850 suzuki and once on a '85 goldwing. both times red stuff made it into the carbs and required pretty much carb replacement. They would just stick.

I'm trying to look up info on it now. I know I want to get as much crud out as I can, but do I need clean metal with this product or just get rid of loose stuff and flakes?

The Caswell failed after a few years but probably because I didn’t get the tank clean enough.

The KBS system came as a kit with a cleaner, an acid and a paint. You can buy the parts individually from KBS to clean and etch the tank and I highly recommend that even if you want to use the Caswell 2-part epoxy liner. Caswell might sell similar stuff to KBS for cleaner and acid.

This is the kit I used from KBS.

KBS Cycle Tank Sealer Kit | Motorcycle Fuel Tank Sealer

All-inclusive motorcycle fuel tank sealer kit for tanks up to 5 gallons. Includes KBS Klean, RustBlast, and Gold Standard Tank Sealer to clean, prep, and permanently seal rust on steel, aluminum, and fiberglass tanks.

www.kbs-coatings.com

The paint seems to be similar to what POR-15 is, but I have never used the POR-15 so can’t say for sure. I can say that the KBS paint is hard after it cures and expands during curing so don’t let it get on the threaded holes. I painted it over the fuel inlet hole and the fuel cap is now difficult to thread on and off so I need to get some sandpaper after that. That is a large course thread that I was surprised would be affected by a layer of paint. I also struggled with paint getting in the threads of the petcock and the drain plug and being a bit difficult to get the threads clean. So I suggest you get some long rubber plugs and screw them into the holes. Also have the tank rest towards the top of the tank while it is curing. I assumed the paint was cured and wouldn’t run after I let it drain for some (long) time and set the tank on the bottom. Some paint did get into the threads so I had to use a pick to clean the first few threads to get the petcock (tapered) and drain plug (straight) started.

I had been more cautious when using the Caswell 2 part epoxy. So I didn’t have any problems.

 

[jwarrenjr]

I suppose you can design an alternate support for the column and an alternate tank.

Just a random thought because my brain doesn't stop working about this stuff. If I were to determine the original tank was no good and I was going to abandon it, I don't think there would be much fab work to do. The steering column support is all ready there. So leave the old tank in place cut away at it until enough clearance is made for the new tank. If too much of the old tank is removed and the steering column isn't supported well, then make a bit of brace work to support the remain portion of the original tank.

If possible, cut the old tank in such a way it would could be used for a shelf for the new tank. Then you could take measurements and order a tank that would fit. Get some metal strapping to secure it and bingo bango, I just made this seem like it's a straight forward job!

 

[Russell King]

Yes you could probably just cut the front of the tank out and use it as a shelf and as a support for the steering wheel.

The tank is fairly thin metal so would be difficult for the average welder to do much with. I think a good TIG welder would not have much problem with welding the tank. I originally was considering just having the bottom 1/3 to 1/2 cut off and just weld a new bottom into the tank.

The tank on my tractor has a seam about 1/2 way up the tank. The seam also is the place the tank is bolted to some supports that also hold up the dash cowl.

 

[jwarrenjr]

yes! the Goldwing that I did I chopped it up and made it into a cafe racer of sorts. And a good tank is thin, with it being rusted out it's thinner. So partially it was spot welding with a mig welder, until those with me found a very thick copper bar. It worked well for a heat sink so we could do more welding vs just blowing holes. Tig would be the way to go. Maybe oxygas if you're handy with that.

The seam should have more meat in it though. Should help out with burning through.

With the shelf idea though, once you cut it you have access to the inside AND out. So absolute worse case, don't weld it at all. You could get flat stock and bend it to the contour of the tank. After that bolt or rivet the tank to the flat stock. double up inside and out if you want to. You then you could weld to that.

I'm still just spit balling. I'm think I'm going to attempt the epoxy coating first. I'm looking at the KBS...I have had better luck with epoxy products. But I think I'm also set on first welding up the petcock hole and re-tapping it to a standard size fitting I can get off the shelf somewhere. Mine is leaking a bit while open, and when I changed the fuel filter it didn't totally shut off. Unless someone can source one for cheaper, I only found ONE with matching part numbers and it was 130 buck (WOW!). And that's hoping the L245 lines up with mine in this case. I'm going to do a 90 degree elbow and inline shutoff. metal ball valve, no plastic stuff.

https://www.messicks.com/parts/kubota/31220-35400

 

[D2Cat]

Might send a message to "Mountainman" on this forum. He has a Kubota salvage yard.

 

[Russell King]

@jwarrenjr

You can source used parts from @007kubotaguy at this number. He provided me with a better tank (no holes) after my first attempt failed (Caswell). He provided a rebuilt petcock along with the tank. I assume he knows which tank would work with your L2201 if you want to go that route.



He is in California so shipping may be a costly issue though!

On the bushing between the tank and steering column: There was a rubber donut thing that fit tight to the column and that worked okay but then I ordered another part number that was a hard plastic two part circular wedge that would work (doesn’t align the half’s 100% properly).

Here is the part number and a picture installed

 

[jwarrenjr]

Thank you!! I will look into all of that!

I ran into this link that should be the repair I need for my petcock!!!

 

[Henro]

Am I understanding correctly that the tank is not leaking and mechanically sound, but that essentially it’s kind of cruddy inside? I’m wondering why you wouldn’t do whatever you need to do to clean it out well, and follow that with practices such as keeping the tank full of diesel when you’re not using the tractor, in order to prevent or minimize condensation which can lead to the rusting situation. As compared to going through the effort of trying to rig up a replacement.

It sounds like you also have an issue with a leaking fuel tank valve which you may be able to fix following that video that you posted which I didn’t watch yet.

Could you be making a mountain out of a mole hill? Just my first thought/impression…

Also a second thought. When you replaced the tubing to the injector, did you use a factory replacement?. I only ask because I’ve read that the tubing length between the injector pump and the injector can affect timing, due to a change in the transport time of the pressure pulse that comes from the injector pump. This seemed reasonable to me but I don’t know if it’s a fact.

 

[jwarrenjr]

No, the petcock is secondary. You are correct in that I could clean it out, unless the rust holes are currently plugged up with rust and it leaks after that. But either way, a rusted tank will rust again. You can do things to slow it down, but it's going to happen. Because one thing, you can't run the tractor without the fuel level receding. So unless you covert to an un-vented bladder system, atmosphere is going to effect the tank walls. I'm not trying to convince anyone to side with me just sharing all the things I'm considering and brain storming.

The fuel line I got was an amazon special and for the 30 min it was running, and before the rust clogged it up, I had no issues or sign of an issue. I understand the physics you're talking about, I think it's too short for pressure pulses to matter. At most it would be the needle that broke the camel's back kind of thing. If I am wrong, I can attest to a fuel line without pressure pulse consideration runs FAR better than a fuel line that won't seal!

 

[Henro]

The only thing I can think to add is that perhaps fuel tanks that are holding diesel may react to moisture differently than fuel tanks holding gasoline, since diesel is more like an oil and possibly could be somewhat protective to the fuel tanks inner surface. But that’s just speculation.

I’m not sure I’ve ever read about a diesel tractor fuel tank rusting through from the inside over the last 20 plus years that I’ve been hanging around the tractor forums. The normal concern for condensation in the tank seems to be the water finding its way to the injector pump.

 

[Russell King]

The only thing I can think to add is that perhaps fuel tanks that are holding diesel may react to moisture differently than fuel tanks holding gasoline, since diesel is more like an oil and possibly could be somewhat protective to the fuel tanks inner surface. But that’s just speculation.

I’m not sure I’ve ever read about a diesel tractor fuel tank rusting through from the inside over the last 20 plus years that I’ve been hanging around the tractor forums. The normal concern for condensation in the tank seems to be the water finding its way to the injector pump.

See the thread linked in post number two. My steel tank did rust through on the bottom. The tractor was somewhere in Louisiana and may have sat for years with an empty tank before it was “rescued “, I have no history of where, what when on the tractor. But I also got a replacement tank from @007kubotaguy and it had rust in the bottom of it also but not rusted through. Again I have no idea where the tank was or if it was empty for years close to the ocean.

But it seems the galvanizing coating does fail and rust starts on the tank bottom. I recall reading something about zinc and diesel not being great friends but don’t recall much detail about that any longer.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

It's a steel tank, so take it to a proper 'bodyman' ,and he'll cut out the rotted metal, weld in new in a day. It's not 'rocket science, just Metalworking 101.

 

[jwarrenjr]

@jwarrenjr

You can source used parts from @007kubotaguy at this number. He provided me with a better tank (no holes) after my first attempt failed (Caswell). He provided a rebuilt petcock along with the tank. I assume he knows which tank would work with your L2201 if you want to go that route.

View attachment 170838

He is in California so shipping may be a costly issue though!

I contacted @007kubotaguy and he's a great guy!! we had a short convo, he helped me with some petcock knowledge, and confirmed that video is the petcock fix. So the way I'm going forward is I check out the tank closer and I'm nervous to clean the tank out other than flush it. Kubotaguy said much more than that could reveal pin holes. I drained the fuel filter and fuel was barely coming out so if the fuel filter is plugged I'll have to verify when I crank it back up. I pulled the petcock and it was absolutely packed with rust "mud." I'm just going to run as is until the tank from Kubotaguy shows up (he got me a great price and guarantees it's solid). If/when I run into this issue again, or if I have time, I'm going aluminum. Hands down! Once I swap the tanks, I can keep running the tractor and have the old one for measurements.

 

[lynnmor]

I have a rental house with an oil furnace that uses fuel that is much the same as diesel fuel. The tank is in the basement where the temperature stays nearly the same year round. Since it is standard procedure for tenants to never fill the tank and most of the time have it near empty or completely empty. Of course it rusted thru at the bottom. Before I could take it to the scrap yard they wanted a large access hole in it so they could see inside. You would not believe the buckets of sludge and filth that was inside. So yes, diesel fuel will not prevent rust. The best you can do is to store no more than necessary, keep containers and tank full and maybe add some two cycle oil if you have an older non-emissions engine.

 

[billrigsby]

Might send a message to "Mountainman" on this forum. He has a Kubota salvage yard.

I've been around on this forum for more years than I can remember and I've never heard of this person do you know where he's located?
Currently don't need any parts but just for future reference.

 

[Russell King]

I've been around on this forum for more years than I can remember and I've never heard of this person do you know where he's located?
Currently don't need any parts but just for future reference.

I will butt in and give you a link to his business website = see post #1 of this thread

Kubota B and BX series salvage yard

B7100 4wd manual tranny front driveline appears to have a cover with a rubber boot that holds it in place my cover and boot are missing slowly getting tractor rebuilt also shaft that connects to drive shaft is very loose that comes out of front diff is there a bearing or bushing in the cone...

www.orangetractortalks.com

Direct link to website

Mossy Creek Outdoors - Largest Kubota B and BX Salvage Yard in the US

Find high-quality used Kubota parts at great prices! Our inventory covers everything you might need, ensuring you get reliable components for your equipment.

mossycreekoutdoors.com

 

[D2Cat]

I've been around on this forum for more years than I can remember and I've never heard of this person do you know where he's located?
Currently don't need any parts but just for future reference.

You already have a link to his business (down below). He's in Northeast Alabama.