MX5100 HST 4X4 safety switch question

[helomech]

It is a brand new 2011 tractor got it last week. I want to fix the safety switch under the seat so it does not stop the engine. I know I can tie wrap the switch down, but was wondering if someone had a schematic of the wiring.

Thanks.

 

[Kytim]

Because of the liability issues involved I doubt that anyone would advise you to circumvent to safety devices meant to save you from injury. It's the world we live in now.

kytim

 

[helomech]

Not looking for step by step instructions. A diagram is all I need. It is only 3 wires, I maintain helicopters for a living, 3 wires are nothing. Just need to see what they do in this system.

 

[Kytim]

I now understand your screen name! As per my comment a forum is a difficult way to acknowledge one's skills, or intentions for that matter. With your background a tractor schematic would be like reading the sunday funny pages. Please understand where my intention were coming from. I don't know if anyone has ever been prosecuted from giving bad advice on a forum but there's always a first time. Just look at the new cyberbully legislation recently passed.

please accept my apologies sir, tim

 

[cmorningstar01]

My position is safety switches were put on a machine for a reason and disabling them is not suggested, However having said that switches can malfunction and circuits need to be tested so sometimes a safety switch needs to be bypassed to determine if it is functioning correctly, The below information is from my personal experience with safety switches and methods I used to determine if they were malfunctioning and not intended to be used to bypass a safety device during normal operation of a piece of equipment and extreme care and caution should be used to avoid any type of accident.

Most safety switches work on one of two different methods, One type is an open circuit switch and the other a closed circuit switch, On the open circuit switch the downward pressure on the seat closed the circuit thus allowing the electricity to flow, Some lawn tractors use this method and a simple short piece of wire used as a jumper will eliminate the connection and complete the circuit, The closed circuit type is when the downward pressure on the seat opens the connection and when there is no pressure the connections is made and the ignition is shorted. Bypassing this type simply entails unplugging the switch so the circuit is always open.
You indicate you have 3 wires so my guess is that the seat switch is interconnected to one of the pedals either the clutch or brake.
So if I was concerned that my safety switch was not operating properly on my piece of equipment that was not new and not under warranty the first thing I would do would be unplug the switch from the seat and see if that affected the operation of the piece of equipment,In other words if I unplugged the switch and the equipment ran but would not shut off when there was no pressure on the seat then the switch would be suspect, This would confirm to me that the switch was a closed circuit type switch.

 

[Babyfat]

Very well put cmorningstar01

 

[helomech]

I now understand your screen name! As per my comment a forum is a difficult way to acknowledge one's skills, or intentions for that matter. With your background a tractor schematic would be like reading the sunday funny pages. Please understand where my intention were coming from. I don't know if anyone has ever been prosecuted from giving bad advice on a forum but there's always a first time. Just look at the new cyberbully legislation recently passed.

please accept my apologies sir, tim

No problem at all, and I do understand where you where coming from. Someone giving a schematic would not have any part in what I did with that schematic. So I don't think they could get in any trouble.

Thanks.

 

[helomech]

My position is safety switches were put on a machine for a reason and disabling them is not suggested, However having said that switches can malfunction and circuits need to be tested so sometimes a safety switch needs to be bypassed to determine if it is functioning correctly, The below information is from my personal experience with safety switches and methods I used to determine if they were malfunctioning and not intended to be used to bypass a safety device during normal operation of a piece of equipment and extreme care and caution should be used to avoid any type of accident.

Most safety switches work on one of two different methods, One type is an open circuit switch and the other a closed circuit switch, On the open circuit switch the downward pressure on the seat closed the circuit thus allowing the electricity to flow, Some lawn tractors use this method and a simple short piece of wire used as a jumper will eliminate the connection and complete the circuit, The closed circuit type is when the downward pressure on the seat opens the connection and when there is no pressure the connections is made and the ignition is shorted. Bypassing this type simply entails unplugging the switch so the circuit is always open.
You indicate you have 3 wires so my guess is that the seat switch is interconnected to one of the pedals either the clutch or brake.
So if I was concerned that my safety switch was not operating properly on my piece of equipment that was not new and not under warranty the first thing I would do would be unplug the switch from the seat and see if that affected the operation of the piece of equipment,In other words if I unplugged the switch and the equipment ran but would not shut off when there was no pressure on the seat then the switch would be suspect, This would confirm to me that the switch was a closed circuit type switch.

Thanks, the only thing that got me with this switch is that it has two positions. If it wasn't for the two positions than it would be simply jump the two wires, or like you said disconnect them. One with the seat up so you can run chippers and such, and one with the seat down so you have to be sitting. The seat up part of the switch just bypasses the pto part, still can't drive with it up. The all the way down postion allows you to drive and engage the pto.

Again thanks, and very neat way to help. I like the way you think.

 

[cmorningstar01]

So with the seat in the up position the switch is bypassed, Should not be too hard to figure out what type of switch you have(open circuit/closed circuit). If you have a Multi meter you can use the voltmeter and ohmeter to do a little diagnostics

 

[helomech]

So with the seat in the up position the switch is bypassed, Should not be too hard to figure out what type of switch you have(open circuit/closed circuit). If you have a Multi meter you can use the voltmeter and ohmeter to do a little diagnostics

Well with the seat up you can operate the PTO, but not drive the tractor. With the switch in the center position (seat down but unoccupied) you can't do anything but start it. With the seat in the down position (someone sitting on it) you can drive and engage PTO. Just want to know what the wires do before I short something out. About to go outside and unhook the plug, but I think that is going to act like the no operator on board.

I do have a multi meter, but without know what the wires do it won't give me the full picture. Been so busy, just have not had time to chase down the wires. With a schematic it would be so much easier.

Thanks

 

[helomech]

Cannon plug undone tractor dies when tried to drive. Going to use the meter, but not sure what it tells me will be useful. It appears to be a open circuit kills the tractor closed circuit lets it run. But to figure out which wires to jump.

 

[Babyfat]

do you have a fax number? there are multiple pages in the service book I can send you

 

[helomech]

Got a black, blue, and orange wire. Black of course is the common, blue is the seat up wire (pto will work, but tractor won't drive position). Orange is seat down with weight on it (tractor does everything). I could jump the orange and black together, but without a schematic I don't know if something else is in the system. I just hate diving into wires without knowing what they all do.

 

[helomech]

do you have a fax number? there are multiple pages in the service book I can send you

Cool thanks. (936) 544-0190 This is my wifes work fax.

Man that would be great, or you could email it to me. Either way would be great.

 

[Babyfat]

Cool thanks. (936) 544-0190 This is my wifes work fax.

Man that would be great, or you could email it to me. Either way would be great.

It's on its way to her, she should have it, sorry to many pages to scan and email right now

John

 

[helomech]

It's on its way to her, she should have it, sorry to many pages to scan and email right now

John

No problem, thank you so much for your help. Hopefully I can help you out one of these days.

 

[cabu]

Well with the seat up you can operate the PTO, but not drive the tractor. With the switch in the center position (seat down but unoccupied) you can't do anything but start it. With the seat in the down position (someone sitting on it) you can drive and engage PTO...

Sonds like the switch has two stages. And if you don't want to measure the wires, why don't you try the switch? Can't be so difficult.
(Edit: To late, you measured the switch. But remember it's not a chopper. If the shortcut's or open's don't work, your tractor will not crash to ground... )

And regarding "safety" switches, my opinition is that there are to many people using technonogy but have no clue what it is (drying the cat in the microwave...) or some are away from real life, setting up a law suit against a FastFood because the coffee was to hot to drink.
So we "idiots" need to be protected, so we don't harm ourselfs and claim money from someone who sell's something. Sorry, but I don't like this culture. My lawnmower has lost two of his three switches, because I am aware of the technology. It become stranger and more stupid every year. My Rifle (.308) is engraved on the barrel with a warning that it is dangerous!!!
Or to say it straight: I hope and trust in evolution (fit into the environment).

carl

 

[helomech]

Sonds like the switch has two stages. And if you don't want to measure the wires, why don't you try the switch? Can't be so difficult.
(Edit: To late, you measured the switch. But remember it's not a chopper. If the shortcut's or open's don't work, your tractor will not crash to ground... )

And regarding "safty" switches, my opinition is that there are to many people using technonogy but have no clue what it is (drying the cat in the microwave...) or some are away from real life, setting up a law suit against a FastFood because the coffee was to hot to drink.
So we "idiots" need to be protected, so we don't harm ourselfs and claim money from someone who sell's something. Sorry, but I don't like this culture. My lawnmower has lost two of his three switches, because I am aware of the technology. It become stranger and more stupid every year. My Rifle (.308) is engraved on the barrel with a warning that it is dangerous!!!
Or to say it straight: I hope and trust in evolution (fit into the environment).

carl

Thanks and well said. I hate most of the safety type things. I won't even buy a pistol with a manual safety on it.

I just don't want to send power to a wire that is not supposed to have power, and maybe burn something up. It is nice working on something for a change that won't fall out of the sky if I mess up.

The main reason I want to disable this is because I can't see the forks from the seated position. I need to stand up and creep forward, and can't do it with this switch.

The fax machine at my wifes office is out of ink, so they have to run and get ink. Hopefully the fax still goes through.

 

[cabu]

...It is nice working on something for a change that won't fall out of the sky if I mess up...

You maybe only stuck somewhere in the middel of nowhere with 2 ton's of steel in the mud.

Have fun with your Kubota and I believe you will become a valuable member of our little group here.

carl

 

[helomech]

You maybe only stuck somewhere in the middel of nowhere with 2 ton's of steel in the mud.

Have fun with your Kubota and I believe you will become a valuable member of our little group here.

carl

Yeah, much better than falling out the sky.

Thanks already got over 10 hours on it, and loving every minute of it.

What part of Germany are you from? I spent 2 years in Ansbach, at Katterbach. Man I sure had lots of fun over there. Going to bring the wife there one of these days.