L2050DT Re-powering

[zuric]

Well, #NG guy here. Been reading the forums, lots of knowledge hereabouts, and I am in need of some.
Bought a 90 or so Kubota L2050DT, 1102ae engine. Tractor ran out well, seemed to need mostly cosmetics. Got it home, 1st thing is change oil. Pan has 1/2 quart of antifreeze in it. Screwed royally.
Okay, water runs into oil pan fast as it is poured into radiator. Operating, about to remove front gear case, see if O-rings or seals are bad. 1102AE Engines appear to be non-existent, the Japanese engine guys say this engine no longer imported due to too many busted heads.
Now...ANYBODY out there grafted ANY other 3 cylinder engine into this tractor ? Any information will be immensely appreciated ...or perhaps you have a 1102ae engine ?
Thanks for any replies, even if you rip me for buying a busted tractor !!

 

[007kubotaguy]

Hello
I am parting out a L2350DT. I believe it is the same motor as your L2050DT. If you would like to send me a PM and see if it will work for you that would be great. Thank You Lance

 

[D2Cat]

Zuric, before you presume the worst, why not pull the head and see what you discover?

You say it ran out well. Then you say water runs into the pan as fast as you pour it in the radiator. For water to get from the radiator to the pan that fast you almost have to have a major hole in the block. How did it run well with a hole in the block?

I's say before you start buying, do some investigating. You may come up with a pleasant surprise.

Here's some more reading for you. http://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=jd&th=223144

 

[zuric]

007; Thank you, will respond as soon as I figure out the system to do so.

D2CAT ; Am forging ahead at the task, got the front gear case off just before dark. 3 smaller 'o' rings, and 1 big seal. The big seal from block to water flange/upper radiator hose APPEARS to have been leaking, rust and corrosion pretty apparent on the 'sealing ' surface of the seal and adjacent to it on the gear case.
I am going to seal the lower holes and introduce water into upper big hole and see if that leads to a gusher out the crankcase drains tomorrow..keeping my fingers crossed clear up to the wrist, I tell you !
Next the head comes off, if that is a failure.
Now, a question ? Supposing that the seal are leaking, and not a cracked block/head, would you go ahead and pull the oil pan and replace the inserts, just to get ahead of perhaps destroying the crankshaft ?

 

[zuric]

D2CAT; Just went and read the link. Hmmm and a couple of hums. That may well be the culprit. The followups are disturbing, from saying that no major damage occurred to total engine failure. We shall see. This L2050DT is just about the right size for what I want to do, and the transmission, final drive, and front drive seem ship-shape.

 

[coachgeo]

If Im not mistaken other xx02 engines can be used to replace that one if it does not end up being something simple... ish

 

[zuric]

Coach;
That is good to know, d1402s' seem to be available, if pricey. The sad tale of this tractor is like a whodunit..what NEXT ? When I first filled the radiator, I immediately noticed a leak at the front of the engine. Tracing the leak brought me to a packed in pile of grease and 'something' the consistency of clay..effectively concealing the totally broken in half water flange for the upper radiator hose, and slowing the gushing leak to a spread out trickle...there is a special area in the hot place for crooks and thieves like the guy I bought the tractor from...
The upside is the simplicity of working on the tractor, from pulling the instrument/dash panels to replace the ignition switch to removing the front gear box. I also punched a 2" hole in dash for the temperature gauge I retrofitted, and drilled and tapped the water flange for the sensor.

 

[D2Cat]

Zuric, it would probably make for a better nights sleep if you pulled the pan and checked the rod bearings. But....it's a toss up. You have any idea of how long the water has been in the oil? How long have you owned the tractor? Was the oil OK when you bought it?

Those are the questions I'd be asking myself to determine how far to go, if what you found is the problem.

I think that engine holds about 6 1/2 qts. of oil. If you had 1 pint of water in there, that's a small percentage...less then 8%. I'm leaning on putting good oil in there and tractor on!!

You probably know this, but a reminder. There are two drain plugs in the oil pan. One on each side of the front drive shaft. Got to drain both to get all the oil out.

 

[zuric]

D2;
Bought the tractor about a month ago. Drained the oil a day or two after I got it. Oil was nasty, been in there awhile. Changed oil, ran the tractor, without adding any water, about ten moments, long enough to re-position it where I wanted to work on it. That is when I filled the radiator and discovered the broken water flange.
Yeah, the drain plugs bring up another 'gotcha'...one of them is stripped. Screws in, never tightens up.

 

[D2Cat]

From what you describe I would not pull the pan. You indicate oil was OK, then you noticed water after a short run period. Fix the problem of water getting into the oil and go on.


The stripped drain plug...on this forum go up to the "search" and look for something like "stripped drain plug" and see what threads you dig up.

If the threads on your drain plug looks at all messed up, I'd buy a new one from a dealer and see how it threads in before any thing else. Be sure to get a copper washer for the plug.

You have to figure a fix for the plug, 'cause a new pan cost $180 and it's a pain to get to it. Got to remove the front drive shaft. I've got an oil pan with good drain hole threads....... here's a picture of it.

 

[zuric]

D2;
I didn't make it quite clear, sorry. The oil upon first draining, right after getting the orange beast, was sorta 'lumpy', complete with water in it, and every indication of being unchanged for a long time. Been trying to think of a way to separate the water and oil so as to have a definite idea instead of a guess at present about actual amount of water.
Going to upload a picture or two...IF I can figure out the proper procedure !.

 

[bucktail]

If you're just trying to figure out how much water is in there, you could just weigh or measure it, cook off the water without smoking the oil and weigh or measure it again. There has to be a better way to assess the damage though.

 

[zuric]

Picture experiment ; appears to work. This is a picture of broken water flange.

 

[zuric]

Maybe a new deal. As D2CAT mentioned, sometimes a hog gets a kernel..or something like that. I looked the front case over in the daylight, and realized that water really only passed thru it at the upper water flange area. I bolted the thermostat housing over the hole and poured it full. Imagine my surprise to see the freeze plug squirting water 6" out...and delight, might I add !!! The big rubber 'o' ring is also pretty shot. NO WATER running into crankcase..thank the Lord !!
Notice, also, the deformed 'o' rings sealing off the oil passages.

 

[zuric]

More updates on this little beast;
After getting front gear case cleaned up ,painted, and reassembled, I blithely poured new oil in, THEN filled the radiator..and listened as the water POURED into the crankcase ! Now I knew I was dead..parting the tractor out becoming a real option.
The next step was to pull the head off and see just how bad it was busted. Removed the valve cover, it was rather clean under there, no real amount of sludge, unexpected. Looking thing over, I then removed the valve train, finding that number 2 cylinder was absent its'.. 'valve cap'..the roller on top of the valve stem.No real big deal..just another example of utter carelessness/neglect of previous owners.
pulled rockers off, set them on bench,turned back to engine and there, lying beside its' bore, was a freeze plug !!
Ordered 50 bucks worth of gaskets, freeze plugs (9 of them !) from local dealer..came the next day, they charged me 5 bucks freight..I put it all back together.
# 3 cylinder valves had NO clearance at all..were applying considerably pressure at all times. ALL valves were tight..002 to .005.
The tractor had been balky, hard to start previously, but ran well when it did kick off. Drained fuel tank, replaced fuel filter, filter had some water in it.
Bled system, had to crank about a minute, off and on..hitting the glow plugs hard, and she banged off !!! Blubbered a bit, spwewed smoke and 'stuff' out the pipe, and settled into a nice purr..gratifying.
Now..onward to fix the 'little things'..like the ball ends on the lift arms, and the worn out tie rod ends...And I just bought 1 brand new 11.2x24 tire yesterday for 100 bucks from a local guy..ahhh, if he just had 2 !!
Thanks to everybody that took the trouble to advise me with information and knowledge !!

 

[D2Cat]

Zuric, you better be careful or you're going to get that tractor running with full power... and you won't have anything to do!!

Nice to see you're not sending it to the scrap yard!

It's a tough way to learn about a tractor, but what you learned you'll never forget. Pass it on to others! Good work.

 

[RCW]

It's a tough way to learn about a tractor, but what you learned you'll never forget. Pass it on to others! Good work.

Well said.

Good for you, Zuric!

 

[clay45]

I have the same tractor but a 1989 model. It had been neglected by the guy I bought it from so I went thru it, changed all fluid and filters, and glow plugs. Most electrical works but no lights to speak of, Replaced belt, hoses, seat, and bucket and its been great ever since.

 

[zuric]

Well, have been off on a little jaunt. Thank y'all for replies. Found a brand new 11.2-24 8 ply for a hundred bucks, scarfed it up. 1 more to go, and a couple of 7-16's.
Ever source says that the 3 point is a Cat 1, but the lift arms are 3/4" in thick, and 2 3/4" wide,,Cat 2. Was going to order new ball ends, but they want as much to ship them as the ends cost..15-20 dollars. Waiting till I get by Atwoods or Orchelins.
Also, instead of giving Kubota 200 odd bucks for a drag link, gonna cut the ends off and graft new tie rod adjusters on each end, and screw a common (read; cheap) tie rod end in place of it...ASSUMING, of course, they used a findable socket taper.
Then, there is the attachment point for the right lift arm..they broke the bracket under the axle off...so they put a 3/8' bolt thru the angle and lift arm...

The things people do. Just TOO much trouble to remove a few bolts and do a bit of welding...

 

[D2Cat]

Zuric, you found a deal on that tire, but it may have to pay a higher price to find one to match. If you ever get up to the K.C. area give a call to Tire Town. They're over in Shawnee and have extremely competitive prices...new and used.

When you cut and modify your tie rod, use this method to have the steel back to full strength after the weld.

Post a picture of your 3 point linkage with the cat 2.