BH77 not working right

Maxelectric76

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L2501/BH77
Jul 11, 2023
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95470
Hey gang,
I just bought a brand new L2501 with a BH77
My question: Is it normal for the backhoe bucket to close Slower than it opens
 

ken erickson

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B7100 hst, 2650 front mount snowblower, L2501 hst qa loader
Nov 21, 2010
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Waupaca Wisconsin
Welcome to Orange Tractor Talks!

I think you will get better results with your question in one of the other other sub forums versus here in Buy, Sell & Trade.
Consider Service, Repair & Maintenance or Implements and Attachments.

Good luck with your new L2501 and Bh77!
 
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North Idaho Wolfman

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Welcome to Orange Tractor Talks!

I think you will get better results with your question in one of the other other sub forums versus here in Buy, Sell & Trade.
Consider Service, Repair & Maintenance or Implements and Attachments.

Good luck with your new L2501 and Bh77!
I moved it. ;)
 
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cthomas

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LX2610 HSDC
Jan 1, 2017
863
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Can you time it and post results Also at what RPM's are you at? I run the engine at about 1.8K as I find the BH operator is much smoother at lower RPM's.
 

PoTreeBoy

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L35 Ford 3930
Mar 24, 2020
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WestTn/NoMs
Hey gang,
I just bought a brand new L2501 with a BH77
My question: Is it normal for the backhoe bucket to close Slower than it opens
I would expect it to close slower, yes. Curling the bucket is accomplished by extending the cylinder. There is more volume on that side of the piston, so it takes longer to fill. More area, too, so it has more force when curling.
 
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dirtydeed

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B2650 BH77, U27-4R2, BX23TLBM, box blade, rear blade, flail mower, Stump Grinder
Dec 8, 2017
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Wind Gap, PA
I would expect it to close slower, yes. Curling the bucket is accomplished by extending the cylinder. There is more volume on that side of the piston, so it takes longer to fill. More area, too, so it has more force when curling.
PoTreeBoy nailed it.
 

PA452

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B2650
Nov 8, 2015
316
47
28
Western PA
Yep, mine is the same way. Honestly I don't notice it as much when operating, when I'm running at higher RPM. But I definitely notice it when I first start it up.

Sometimes if I park it outside and it gets rained on, when I first fire the tractor up, I have it near idle for it to warm up, I'll reach back and dump the water out of the backhoe bucket. I definitely notice in that situation the bucket dumps quick, and probably takes 3x as long to curl back up.
 

Runs With Scissors

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L2501 TLB , Grappel, Brush Hog, Box Blade, Ballast box, Forks, Tiller, PH digger
Jan 25, 2023
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Michigan
I just tested mine and it's about a 2 to 1 ratio.

It takes approx. 6 seconds to close and 3.5'ish seconds to open.

Interestingly enough, rpm did not seem to have a significant effect on opening and closing times, but remember I was do the "Scientific" One Mississippi, Two Mississippi method. 🍻
 

TheOldHokie

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Apr 6, 2021
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windyridgefarm.us
I just tested mine and it's about a 2 to 1 ratio.

It takes approx. 6 seconds to close and 3.5'ish seconds to open.

Interestingly enough, rpm did not seem to have a significant effect on opening and closing times, but remember I was do the "Scientific" One Mississippi, Two Mississippi method. 🍻
This is where my formal training would send me to a calculator not a stop watch.

SCIENTIFIC

Its a fixed displacement pump so opening and closing times will vary linearly with pump RPM. Double the pump RPM and you double the cylinder speed in both directions.

For a double acting cylinder the ratio of retract and extend speed is determined by the oil capacities (volumes) of the two ends. Lets do a little middle school (???) solid geometry.

Let:

Rp = radius of the piston
Rr = radius of the rod
L = overall stroke of the cylinder

Then:

Volume of base end = Vb = PI x Rp**2 x L
Volume of rod end = Vr = Vb - (PI x Rr**2 x L)
Ratio of speeds - Vb/Vr

EXAMPLE

What is the retract/extend speed ration of a DA cylinder with 2" bore, 1" rod, and 20" stroke?

Rp = 1
Rr = .5
L= 20

Vb = 3.14 x (1**2) x 20 = 62.8
Vr = 62.8 - (3.14 x (.5**2) x L)) = 62.8 - 15.7 = 47.1

Retract/extend speed ratio = Vb/Vr = 62.8/47.1 = 1.333

I am pretty confident of the geometry but you might want to double check my arithmetic :oops:

Dan
 

PoTreeBoy

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Mar 24, 2020
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This is where my formal training would send me to a calculator not a stop watch.

SCIENTIFIC

Its a fixed displacement pump so opening and closing times will vary linearly with pump RPM. Double the pump RPM and you double the cylinder speed in both directions.

For a double acting cylinder the ratio of retract and extend speed is determined by the oil capacities (volumes) of the two ends. Lets do a little middle school (???) solid geometry.

Let:

Rp = radius of the piston
Rr = radius of the rod
L = overall stroke of the cylinder

Then:

Volume of base end = Vb = PI x Rp**2 x L
Volume of rod end = Vr = Vb - (PI x Rr**2 x L)
Ratio of speeds - Vb/Vr

EXAMPLE

What is the retract/extend speed ration of a DA cylinder with 2" bore, 1" rod, and 20" stroke?

Rp = 1
Rr = .5
L= 20

Vb = 3.14 x (1**2) x 20 = 62.8
Vr = 62.8 - (3.14 x (.5**2) x L)) = 62.8 - 15.7 = 47.1

Retract/extend speed ratio = Vb/Vr = 62.8/47.1 = 1.333

I am pretty confident of the geometry but you might want to double check my arithmetic :oops:

Dan
The WSM says i.d. 2.17" (55 mm), rod o.d. is 1.38" (35 mm) and stroke is 17.8" (451 mm). In the interest of accuracy, please recalc. :geek:
 

TheOldHokie

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windyridgefarm.us
The WSM says i.d. 2.17" (55 mm), rod o.d. is 1.38" (35 mm) and stroke is 17.8" (451 mm). In the interest of accuracy, please recalc. :geek:
Just looking at the two diameters rod is much bigger relative to bore so we know its going to be faster than the example.

Vb = 65.83
Vr = 65.83 - 26.625 = 42.2
Vb/ Vr = 1.56
 
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