Gasoline Particulate Filters

GreensvilleJay

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If ( IF ) the EPA wanted to do the right thing, they'd get the guv to BAN all tobacco products, tomorrow. we'd all be living far healthier lives
 

jimh406

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If ( IF ) the EPA wanted to do the right thing, they'd get the guv to BAN all tobacco products, tomorrow. we'd all be living far healthier lives
Not sure ... you guys up North seem to be doing ok without an EPA. Fwiw, we seem to be legalizing more things that give off smoke including wacky tobacco. ;)
 
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The Evil Twin

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The original post that created this discussion was the hope of elimination of the EPA. Without enforcement of the clean air and water acts, how long would it be before the dirty 70s returns? Now if we are discussing different ways of achieving clean air and water, then that’s different. But in truth, people are driving vehicles with modern emission technologies every day and most don’t have issues. I know that I never had a problem with my TDI car, and it had regenerations periodically without causing any concerns.
Exactly. Your (I assume diesel diesel TDI, but a TDI engine is not exclusively diesel) and my truck (diesel) are probably cleaner than most gas engines. So why make the emissions systems more complicated, expensive and less reliable? It's only to make them less desirable.
Enforcing EXISTING laws are not going to return us to the 70s you fear. Like you said: rivers don't burn anymore. So we are good. No need to get stupid with restrictions. Unless there is another agenda.
 
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DustyRusty

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The government doesn't ban smoking because they want the tax money that it brings into the coffers. They also know that smokers die on average a lot younger and the government can keep their social security contributions and never pay out a dime. Always follow the money and where the money flows, will show why regulations are in place. The US government has proposed taking away gas cooking stoves. We already have a shortage of electric generation but they want to create more electrical appliances to replace those that use natural or propane gas. It is all about control and the money.
 
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jyoutz

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Exactly. Your (I assume diesel diesel TDI, but a TDI engine is not exclusively diesel) and my truck (diesel) are probably cleaner than most gas engines. So why make the emissions systems more complicated, expensive and less reliable? It's only to make them less desirable.
Enforcing EXISTING laws are not going to return us to the 70s you fear. Like you said: rivers don't burn anymore. So we are good. No need to get stupid with restrictions. Unless there is another agenda.
No EPA, no enforcement of existing laws. That was the original discussion.
 

jyoutz

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The government doesn't ban smoking because they want the tax money that it brings into the coffers. They also know that smokers die on average a lot younger and the government can keep their social security contributions and never pay out a dime. Always follow the money and where the money flows, will show why regulations are in place. The US government has proposed taking away gas cooking stoves. We already have a shortage of electric generation but they want to create more electrical appliances to replace those that use natural or propane gas. It is all about control and the money.
Some states have proposed banning the sale of gas stoves, not the U.S. government.
 

The Evil Twin

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No EPA, no enforcement of existing laws. That was the original discussion.
That's like saying if MADD were to dissolve or disband, no one would enforce the BAC limit for drunk driving.
The EPA isn't at the truck stops and inspection stations. Those that are inpecting the trucks are MCS State Police or private employees of a business. The EPA doesn't enforce anything. The DOJ and the courts do.
 
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jyoutz

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That's like saying if MADD were to dissolve or disband, no one would enforce the BAC limit for drunk driving.
The EPA isn't at the truck stops and inspection stations. Those that are inpecting the trucks are MCS State Police or private employees of a business. The EPA doesn't enforce anything. The DOJ and the courts do.
The EPA develops standards for the clean air and water acts. Then they provide grant funds to and work with state agencies to enforce them. My state has a department of environmental quality that enforces these things using the EPA funds and assistance. For example, there are standards for roads crossing streams and logging project clean up, reseeding, and other operations to protect water quality. There are also standards for the oil field operations. Recent changes to the standards changed oil field water pits because too many bird and wildlife were being killed in these pits. Other changes reduced flaring of wells to reduce methane emissions and to recapture the natural gas that was previously wasted. This reduced air pollution, while avoiding the wastes of natural gas. These operations all come from the laws and EPA standards and industry didn’t adopt them on their own. All states have enforcement agencies that work with and are funded by EPA to enforce clean air and water acts.
 
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The Evil Twin

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The EPA develops standards for the clean air and water acts. Then they provide grant funds to and work with state agencies to enforce them. My state has a department of environmental quality that enforces these things using the EPA funds and assistance. For example, there are standards for roads crossing streams and logging project clean up, reseeding, and other operations to protect water quality. There are also standards for the oil field operations. Recent changes to the standards changed oil field water pits because too many bird and wildlife were being killed in these pits. Other changes reduced flaring of wells to reduce methane emissions and to recapture the natural gas that was previously wasted. This reduced air pollution, while avoiding the wastes of natural gas. These operations all come from the laws and EPA standards and industry didn’t adopt them on their own. All states have enforcement agencies that work with and are funded by EPA to enforce clean air and water acts.
But you still think existing laws are going to cease to be enforced should the agency (any of them) cease to exist? 🙄 it's clear you don't understand the way government works. It's also clear that I am not going to be able to help you understand.
Have a Merry Christmas.
 

GreensvilleJay

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Well if the EPA gets their way , farmers won't be farming for long. Between the proposed 'no dust allowed' and 'no cow farts allowed' rules ( no laws BTW.. EPA cannot make LAWS ) . All fariming int eh USA wil cease PDQ !!
Happy New Year !!!
 

jyoutz

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Well if the EPA gets their way , farmers won't be farming for long. Between the proposed 'no dust allowed' and 'no cow farts allowed' rules ( no laws BTW.. EPA cannot make LAWS ) . All fariming int eh USA wil cease PDQ !!
Happy New Year !!!
None of this is true. Fake news.
 

jyoutz

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But you still think existing laws are going to cease to be enforced should the agency (any of them) cease to exist? 🙄 it's clear you don't understand the way government works. It's also clear that I am not going to be able to help you understand.
Have a Merry Christmas.
I work for the federal government and understand exactly how it works. All of our timber sale erosion control work has to be compliant with the clean water act and we get EPA 404 permits for water crossings. And prescribed burning requires compliance with clean air act and we follow the permitting process. It’s clear that you aren’t familiar with the processes.
 

GreensvilleJay

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Greensville,Ontario,Canada
You can go to the EPA's website and find the documents, or just use Google...
what's interesting about the GPF is they allow MORE of the SMALLER particles into the air and still no response as to HOW adding the filter INCREASES MPG.
 

jyoutz

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You can go to the EPA's website and find the documents, or just use Google...
what's interesting about the GPF is they allow MORE of the SMALLER particles into the air and still no response as to HOW adding the filter INCREASES MPG.
The fake news is the no cow farts and no dust nonsense.
 

GreensvilleJay

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BX23-S,57 A-C D-14,58 A-C D-14, 57 A-C D-14,tiller,cults,Millcreek 25G spreader,
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Greensville,Ontario,Canada
one quick finding....
from the EPA...
Last year, IATP and other environmental justice and climate groups petitioned the EPA to begin to regulate methane emissions from the largest hog and dairy operations under the Clean Air Act. The EPA has yet to act on the petition. Regulatory action needs to be coupled with a reformed 2023 Farm Bill to support farmers raising animals in more agroecological systems and those transitioning out of the factory farm system. These steps would set a clear and predictable path for reaching the 2030 Methane Pledge target and contribute to the country’s Paris Climate agreement commitments.

it'd be interesting to read the revised 'farm bill' that was just passed....especially since cow farts/ pig farts are far more than the oil+gas industries put out.
 

jyoutz

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MX6000 HST open station, FEL, 6’ cutter, forks, 8’ rear blade, 7’ cultivator
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Edgewood, New Mexico
one quick finding....
from the EPA...
Last year, IATP and other environmental justice and climate groups petitioned the EPA to begin to regulate methane emissions from the largest hog and dairy operations under the Clean Air Act. The EPA has yet to act on the petition. Regulatory action needs to be coupled with a reformed 2023 Farm Bill to support farmers raising animals in more agroecological systems and those transitioning out of the factory farm system. These steps would set a clear and predictable path for reaching the 2030 Methane Pledge target and contribute to the country’s Paris Climate agreement commitments.

it'd be interesting to read the revised 'farm bill' that was just passed....especially since cow farts/ pig farts are far more than the oil+gas industries put out.
Doubtful that this will go anywhere. Lots of groups petition agencies. That’s SOP. Rule making is a long and complex process that Congress directs. The U.S. agriculture lobby is one of the most powerful in the country, and one that both parties strive to satiate. Agriculture has more clout with congress than the petroleum industry. The current farm bill has nothing about cow fart regulations and wasn’t even controversial with either party.
 

jimh406

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Most of what federal govt agencies do is create rules and interpretation. They aren‘t actual laws, so the rules can go away any time.
 

jyoutz

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Edgewood, New Mexico
Most of what federal govt agencies do is create rules and interpretation. They aren‘t actual laws, so the rules can go away any time.
Rule making is a process that is established by Congress that agencies must follow. They are published in the congressional record, receive public comments, and go through reviews by Congress before they are adopted. Rules cannot be contradictory to laws; they are processes that implement or enforce congressional laws and they must go through a similar review process to be changed or removed.