Hello. My ZD221 zero turn won’t start. Battery is good. I have good voltage at the starter. I tested the solenoid and it appears good. I’ve gone through the two lever safety switches, the seat safety switch, the pto/mower engage safety switch and the brake safety switch. I get variable and mostly dim lights on the indicator lights by the key when on. Absolutely nothing happens when the key is turned to start. All fuses are good. I feel like this is a loose connection somewhere but I’m at a loss of where to look now. I have a BX25D on hand if I need to swap parts to troubleshoot. Thoughts? My grass is getting really tall :-(
ZD221 won’t start. Electrical issue
- Thread starter hunterisgreat
- Start date
A few questions.
How did you check the voltage at the starter?
How did you test the solenoid?
Have you tried jumping the starter?
If you jump the starter and it cranks that rules out a lot of things. However, jumping a starter involves a dangerous operation if you are not careful as all safeties are bypassed. Best to have someone in the drivers seat. If the levers were in a forward or reverse position the tractor might start and begin moving immediately.
Do you know how to jump the starter?
My first inclination is that you have a poor battery connection. First to check is where the ground cable connects to the tractor frame or engine block. Remove that connection and clean all mating surfaces.
Do your battery cables have repair ends on them?
This style of cable repair terminal causes endless problems.
Dave
Clean battery terminals and connectors which attach to them. Follow the ground wire to the frame and be sure you have a clean solid connection there as well.
A battery which tests good voltage (12.7+) ... does NOT demonstrate a battery that can DELIVER high amperage. If the battery can’t support bright lights... it can’t start an engine.
Use jumper cables directly to the starter and if that works... then it’s not the battery. If it doesn’t work...it is the battery.
Don’t get run over by your tractor when it starts. Have it in neutral. Double check.
Use jumper cables directly to the starter and if that works... then it’s not the battery. If it doesn’t work...it is the battery.
Don’t get run over by your tractor when it starts. Have it in neutral. Double check.
It will start and run fine when jumped. It won’t stop when the key is removed though if that helps
There is a clue in the wont stop in Key Off position.
I do not have a WSM for your mower so am guessing a bit.
If the engine starts with a jump but then wont stop with the key it must have a engine stop solenoid which is provided with power for a few seconds to stop the engine rather than one which powers the solenoid all the time the engine is running.
I would be looking for a fuse that is blown or has a poor connection to its fuse box terminals. Check relays for proper seating in their sockets..
There will be a relay/ timer to stop the engine and possibly one for the starter
Do you have a wiring diagram you could provide?
Dave
does the shop manual help?https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rEWfCTC18iHXJk8Nniqb0ZqwGPqcA0bZ/view?usp=drivesdk
Battery is a solid 13.change and load tests well on a tester. For good measure jumpered it to my backhoe. No change. I have it on jack stand for all this testing to be safe
It will but give me a couple of hours to go through it.
I will be back with more suggestions.
Dave
I am starting to understand your mower a bit.
The many safety switches send their signal to a controller, a sort of logic box or computer, which makes determination if the engine can continue to run or start. It is not a simple system with a number of safety switches in series.
One safety switch is different than all others. It is the parking switch which is normally closed where the other switches are normally open.
This uniqueness is utilized by this safety feature: if the engine is started and the parking brake is not released within two seconds the engine is stopped.
The controller's out put signals go to two places. The starter relay to crank the engine and the engine stop relay to stop the engine.
There are five safety switches and you must diligently check each one. The seat switch should be the first to check.
From the engine non start troubleshooting section I put an arrow on the slow blow fuse. Find it and check it carefuuly as they can blow but be hard to detect.
I will continue to study the WSM but wanted to give you an interim report.
Dave
The many safety switches send their signal to a controller, a sort of logic box or computer, which makes determination if the engine can continue to run or start. It is not a simple system with a number of safety switches in series.
One safety switch is different than all others. It is the parking switch which is normally closed where the other switches are normally open.
This uniqueness is utilized by this safety feature: if the engine is started and the parking brake is not released within two seconds the engine is stopped.
The controller's out put signals go to two places. The starter relay to crank the engine and the engine stop relay to stop the engine.
There are five safety switches and you must diligently check each one. The seat switch should be the first to check.
From the engine non start troubleshooting section I put an arrow on the slow blow fuse. Find it and check it carefuuly as they can blow but be hard to detect.
I will continue to study the WSM but wanted to give you an interim report.
Dave
the brake switch on those is buried inside the "C" of the frame rail, left side, behind/under the floorboard. It is in an area that is common to get dirt/grass/poo in there, which does 2 things. First, it will sometimes just stick. Secondly (and most commonly) the juices from the cut grass clippings will tear the switch up internally, and it just dies. Replacing it requires removal of the floorboaard, and frankly it's not a bad idea to pull the floor off anyway so you can clean in there. It gets nasty. You'll see what I mean (if you haven't already).
BTW, Dave, the controller doesn't shut the engine off if within 2 seconds of releasing the park brake. It will, however, turn the engine off within 2 seconds IF the control arms are moved from neutral and the brake is not released. Didn't know if you knew that or not, but ya do now!
It has a delay in the system, which does several things.
Lastly, I've run into similar issues with ZD21, 25, and ZD28. Possibly others that I can't remember OTOH, but I DO remember those. It's almost always a bad ground on those, and it's almost always in the harness somewhere. I've found it a couple times, other times the owner said "just replace the harness", which is a better fix anyway. The ones I found; I found an issue at a tap in the ground circuit; where a main ground had another wire tapped into it at a "tee" junction. The tee connection runs to the controller, which then allows the controller to do it's job as designed. Fix ground? Problem solved. Worth mentioning because it can cause all kinds of weird stuff to happen, as grounds (or failing/failed grounds) often do.
BTW, Dave, the controller doesn't shut the engine off if within 2 seconds of releasing the park brake. It will, however, turn the engine off within 2 seconds IF the control arms are moved from neutral and the brake is not released. Didn't know if you knew that or not, but ya do now!
It has a delay in the system, which does several things.Lastly, I've run into similar issues with ZD21, 25, and ZD28. Possibly others that I can't remember OTOH, but I DO remember those. It's almost always a bad ground on those, and it's almost always in the harness somewhere. I've found it a couple times, other times the owner said "just replace the harness", which is a better fix anyway. The ones I found; I found an issue at a tap in the ground circuit; where a main ground had another wire tapped into it at a "tee" junction. The tee connection runs to the controller, which then allows the controller to do it's job as designed. Fix ground? Problem solved. Worth mentioning because it can cause all kinds of weird stuff to happen, as grounds (or failing/failed grounds) often do.
Thanks Lugbolt,BTW, Dave, the controller doesn't shut the engine off if within 2 seconds of releasing the park brake. It will, however, turn the engine off within 2 seconds IF the control arms are moved from neutral and the brake is not released. Didn't know if you knew that or not, but ya do now!
I found the logic table in the WSM confusing and your explanation makes more sense.
Also, your practical experience will make the owner;s success in getting his machine running much more likely.
Dave
thanks for the assistance. Yeah I’ve had my fingers deep in the c channel on that brake switch. Checking with a multimeter all the safety switches seem to operate correctly. I’ve even disabled some (just seat, brake and pto) with no change. While tracing the wire to the solenoid (black with white stripe) to the relay under the seat, I noticed the wire harness is real dirty. You’re saying I may have a faulty ground somewhere in that harness? Is there a method for locating it or known problem areas? What’s odd to me is the panel lights are variably dim when the key is in the run position. I get nothing on the multimeter at the solenoid when turning to start.the brake switch on those is buried inside the "C" of the frame rail, left side, behind/under the floorboard. It is in an area that is common to get dirt/grass/poo in there, which does 2 things. First, it will sometimes just stick. Secondly (and most commonly) the juices from the cut grass clippings will tear the switch up internally, and it just dies. Replacing it requires removal of the floorboaard, and frankly it's not a bad idea to pull the floor off anyway so you can clean in there. It gets nasty. You'll see what I mean (if you haven't already).
BTW, Dave, the controller doesn't shut the engine off if within 2 seconds of releasing the park brake. It will, however, turn the engine off within 2 seconds IF the control arms are moved from neutral and the brake is not released. Didn't know if you knew that or not, but ya do now!
Lastly, I've run into similar issues with ZD21, 25, and ZD28. Possibly others that I can't remember OTOH, but I DO remember those. It's almost always a bad ground on those, and it's almost always in the harness somewhere. I've found it a couple times, other times the owner said "just replace the harness", which is a better fix anyway. The ones I found; I found an issue at a tap in the ground circuit; where a main ground had another wire tapped into it at a "tee" junction. The tee connection runs to the controller, which then allows the controller to do it's job as designed. Fix ground? Problem solved. Worth mentioning because it can cause all kinds of weird stuff to happen, as grounds (or failing/failed grounds) often do.
UPDATE: pulled the wire harness. One of the three relays under the seat had a corroded and broken wire as can be seen in the video. I assume this was the issue. It appeared to have a large red and small red wire both connected to that corroded place. I cut the remainder off so I can clean them up and reattach to the relay. Anything else I should check while the harness is all the way out?
Attachments
not yet! Fixed relay and hooked back up. No change. Took wire bundle apart and main power line splice was toast. Fixed that. Now I have nice power at the gauges. Still no start though. Directly connected relay that powers the solenoid. I can start with the key fine but have to manually turn the engine off. A small wire came out of the harness that goes to the box next to the relays. I assume this may be my current issue.
I had the same problem that my ZD221 would not start. After test all safety switches found the Brake Switch bad. That bugger is extra hard to get to but go it replaced and all is good now.
Being an Electrical and Mechanical engineer I had to open the switch up to see what was inside that caused the failure. As soon as the switch was cut in half a very lot of dust and dirt came out. Bingo. The location where the brake switch gets a lot of dust and dirt thrown at it. Next time this happen I can fix it faster.
Being an Electrical and Mechanical engineer I had to open the switch up to see what was inside that caused the failure. As soon as the switch was cut in half a very lot of dust and dirt came out. Bingo. The location where the brake switch gets a lot of dust and dirt thrown at it. Next time this happen I can fix it faster.