BX2370 PTO engaging, no power under load - I NEED HELP

[Grambo]

I need some help and I know this has been posted before. I have a BX2370 with a 54" belly mower and this is what's going on:

About 2 weeks prior to the PTO not working under load the mid PTO started turning slowly when not engaged
The PTO would still engage and seemed to work fine but when not engaged would continue to turn slowly
I shut the tractor off and about an our later went out to do some more mowing and the PTO would not engage
I pulled the mower off and the PTO will turn when engaged but not under a load
The rear PTO also turns but you can stop it simply by putting a little pressure on it
Both rear and mid PTOs will lock up when engaged and spin freely when not engaged
I pulled the left wheel, notched the frame and pulled out the PTO clutch valve
I cleaned all of the orifices with an air hose, confirmed that they were free of debris and would allow air to pass, put it back in and still not working
I then pulled the pressure valve (by the filter) and it seems fine (poppet style)
I then pulled the other valve by the rear PTO (not sure of it's name) and it also seems fine
A pressure test of the PTO clutch valve is about 4lbs (should be 180+)
The power steering, 3 point hitch, 4wd etc all work fine
I replaced the o-rings on the PTO clutch valve shaft this morning and still not working
I have drained the fluid 3x so i could pull the various valves (new filter and new fluid on day on of this problem)
The dealership won't give any info about it other than for me to bring it in ($$$)
Everyone at the dealership has their own $.02 about what it is but that they said they NEVER sell clutch packs because they don't go bad.

Any thoughts? I'm at a loss and the grass just keeps on growing....

 

[PoTreeBoy]

I need some help and I know this has been posted before. I have a BX2370 with a 54" belly mower and this is what's going on:

About 2 weeks prior to the PTO not working under load the mid PTO started turning slowly when not engaged
The PTO would still engage and seemed to work fine but when not engaged would continue to turn slowly
I shut the tractor off and about an our later went out to do some more mowing and the PTO would not engage
I pulled the mower off and the PTO will turn when engaged but not under a load
The rear PTO also turns but you can stop it simply by putting a little pressure on it
Both rear and mid PTOs will lock up when engaged and spin freely when not engaged
I pulled the left wheel, notched the frame and pulled out the PTO clutch valve
I cleaned all of the orifices with an air hose, confirmed that they were free of debris and would allow air to pass, put it back in and still not working
I then pulled the pressure valve (by the filter) and it seems fine (poppet style)
I then pulled the other valve by the rear PTO (not sure of it's name) and it also seems fine
A pressure test of the PTO clutch valve is about 4lbs (should be 180+)
The power steering, 3 point hitch, 4wd etc all work fine
I replaced the o-rings on the PTO clutch valve shaft this morning and still not working
I have drained the fluid 3x so i could pull the various valves (new filter and new fluid on day on of this problem)
The dealership won't give any info about it other than for me to bring it in ($$$)
Everyone at the dealership has their own $.02 about what it is but that they said they NEVER sell clutch packs because they don't go bad.

Any thoughts? I'm at a loss and the grass just keeps on growing....

Several years ago, a guy in PR or somewhere offshore had a similar problem with his BX, don't recall the exact model. Some of them have test ports before and after the PTO valve. Yours may only have one after the valve. You've cleaned the valve. About all you can do is pull the PTO relief valve and make sure it's clean and operable. If that's not the problem, you'll have to pull the transmission and check seal rings, etc.

As I recall, the previous gentleman had more pressure than you and tried reaming the holes in the valve. I don't recommend that, because those holes control how fast the clutch engages. I think he ended up going into the transmission.

If you don't have a WorkShop Manual, it's available at KubotaBooks.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

I'm pretty sure there's a previous post ( 1-2 years ago ??) similar problem, turns out 'RTV' or simiilar was in the 'hole' on the left side, several small bits ?
Maybe trying 'searching for it or perhaps someone will KNOW where that post is ?

 

[PoTreeBoy]

Here's the one I was thinking about, 2020 and Jamaica, not PR.

BX25D PTO Oil Pressure low!!!?

Can any one help! we purchased a 2014 BX25DLB in a USA auction in FL to help us in a small homestead farming project in Jamaica W.I. ...every thing is working fine with the tractor i.e. the loader, backhoe etc....only problem we seem to be having is that the ...PTO engages FINE! for 30+ mins...

www.orangetractortalks.com

 

[Grambo]

Thank you and that was a good read! Similar problem but different in the fact that I have almost no pressure at the PTO clutch valve test port and the temp of the hydro fluid makes no difference. Initially I was hoping for a plugged port in the PTO clutch valve but they are all wide open. I don't have any foaming in the fluid that I can see and no indication of any water contamination. Every valve that I have taken out has been pristine inside and I don't see any damage or issues with any of them. I should have mentioned that I bought this tractor new 12 years ago and right off the bat had an oil leak from the HST which turned out to be an over-torqued bolt from the factory that cracked the case. They did a warranty replacement and I've had zero issues since then until now.

I think this is all going to go back to the issue of what's causing there to be almost no pressure at the PTO clutch valve. The rest of the tractor works, drives and functions perfectly. No issues except for the PTO not turning under load, rear and mid both.

A tech told me to take an air hose and blow 60-ish lbs of air into the clutch pack to pressure test it's lockup but I don't know how to do that so if anyone could run me through the "how to" and what adapter(s) I would greatly appreciate giving that a try.

 

[Grambo]

Update:

I pulled the fill hole plug and saw that the hydro fluid was nice and smooth. I started the tractor and within a minute or two, tiny bubbles started showing up on the top of the fluid that resembled a light foam. If this isn't normal then I'm guessing there is an air leak somewhere....? Any thoughts on this and what I should do next? Also, I'm running UDT2.

 

[PoTreeBoy]

* I don't see a way/port to blow air into the clutch without running the risk of blowing air into the hst, which could be detrimental. Besides, I'm not sure what good it would do - you might hear air leaking but then what?

* I don't think a few bubbles on the fluid indicates a problem. If you had an air leak it would be on the pump suction and form a frothy look when it went through the pump.

* Have you figured out where the PTO relief valve is and confirmed that it appears ok?

I think you're about to the point of tearing into the transmission.

 

[RCW]

I agree with @PoTreeBoy.

Some limited bubbles are likely normal, but I'm guessing some.

Often air entrainment is on the suction/low pressure side of the circuit. Doesn't show as a leak but can appear just damp.

 

[Grambo]

I've pulled the pressure relief valve a couple of times and it appears fine, no scratches or anything unusual. It's the poppet style and looks to be in perfect condition. Could the spring be an issue having lost some of it's umph over the years? I"m just spitballing now because I'm trying to think of everything before I actually have to tear down the HST.

 

[whitetiger]

I've pulled the pressure relief valve a couple of times and it appears fine, no scratches or anything unusual. It's the poppet style and looks to be in perfect condition. Could the spring be an issue having lost some of it's umph over the years? I"m just spitballing now because I'm trying to think of everything before I actually have to tear down the HST.

Check the Charge Relief Pressure before you disassemble anything.